Генетичка генеалогија II

Na nacin da je I hg (I2a, I1) autohtona evropska po zvanicnoj nauci genetici i to je apsolutno tacno, ne samo zato sto zvanicno nauka genetika kaze nekim nerazumljivim brojevima i slovima, nego je tacno po principu apsolutne istine, antropologija i lingvistika potvrdjuju genetiku 100% da je I autohtona evropska, I hg bilo gde drugde stize iz evrope i ne moze da bude drugacije.
 
Gde se nalaze I hg i MtdNA H su izvorno srpski-sanskrt "indoevropski" jezici.
Gde je veilka R1a i R1b zajedno sa velikom I i mtDNA H nalaze se indoevropski jezici.
Gde je velika R1a i R1b bez I i mtDNA H nalaze se turkijski jezici.
Gde je velika y-hg N i mtdna U nalaze se uralski ugro-finski jezici (koji nisu evropski, nisu indo-evropski).
Gde je mesavina pola-pola y-hg N / I + R1a mtdna H nalaze se balticki jezici koji su oduvek mala populacija, postoje samo dva Latvijski i Litvanski.
Gde je y-hg J mtdna K nalaze se semitski jezici.
Gde je y-hg G nalaze se kavkaski jezici.
 
Ancient DNA study illuminates Indo-European language origins

WASHINGTON – For decades, researchers have debated how Indo-European languages came to be spoken from the British Isles to South Asia.

Now the largest-ever study of ancient human DNA suggests that the answer may lie with a mass migration of Bronze Age herders from the Eurasian steppes, starting 5,000 years ago, westward to Europe and east to Asia.

Vagheesh Narasimhan, co-first author of the paper, published in the journal Science on Thursday, said that the role of population movements over the past 10,000 years was key to understanding linguistic changes and the transition from hunter-gatherer activities to farming.

“There’s been a lot of DNA work, as well as archaeological work, about both of these processes in Europe,” the postdoctoral fellow at Harvard Medical School explained, but these transformations are less understood in Asia.

A global team of geneticists, archaeologists and anthropologists analyzed the genomes of 524 never-before-studied ancient individuals from Central and South Asia, increasing the worldwide total of published ancient genomes by about 25 percent.

By comparing the genomes to one another and to previously discovered remains, and by placing that information into its historical context through archaeological and linguistic records, the team was able to fill the gaps in our current understanding.

A 2015 paper indicated that Indo-European languages — the world’s biggest language group that includes Hindi-Urdu, Farsi, Russian, English, French, Gaelic and more than 400 others — arrived in Europe via the steppes.

Despite being spread over a vast area encompassing myriad cultures, these languages share uncanny similarities in syntax, numbers, basic adjectives and numerous nouns, including those related to kin, body parts and more.

The path of the proto-Indo-European languages to Asia was less clear. One school of thought held they spread from farmers from Anatolia (present-day Turkey).

But the paper found that present-day South Asians have little if any shared ancestry with these ancient Anatolian farmers.

“We can rule out a large-scale spread of farmers with Anatolian roots into South Asia, the centerpiece of the ‘Anatolian hypothesis’ that such movement brought farming and Indo-European languages into the region,” said co-author David Reich, also at Harvard Medical School. “Since no substantial movements of people occurred, this is checkmate for the Anatolian hypothesis.”

There are two new lines of evidence in favor of steppe origin. First, the researchers detected genetic similarities that connect speakers of the Indo-Iranian and Balto-Slavic branches of Indo-European.

They found that the present-day speakers of both these groups descend from a subgroup of steppe herders who moved west toward Europe 5,000 years ago, then spread back east to Central and South Asia in the following 1,500 years.

Another observation in favor of the theory: South Asians who today speak Dravidian languages (mainly in southern India and southwestern Pakistan) had very little steppe DNA, while those who speak Indo-European languages like Hindi, Punjabi, Bengali have far more.

As far as agriculture is concerned, prior work has found that farming spread to Europe via people of Anatolian ancestry.

South Asians, however, share little to no ancestry with the Anatolians, ruling them out, while the archaeological record shows the activity also predates the steppe herders, leading researchers to conclude agriculture arrived independently in the region.

A second paper, meanwhile, published in the journal Cell Press by several of the same authors, describes the first genome of an individual from the Indus Valley civilization (IVC), one of the great civilizations of the ancient world contemporaneous with Egypt and Mesopotamia.

Its towns, which first appeared 3000 years BCE, were populated by tens of thousands of people, who used standardized weights and measures, built great roads and traded with places as far away as East Africa.

The team was able to overcome technical challenges posed by the hot, humid and monsoonal climate to sequence for the first time a Bronze Age individual from South Asia.

The DNA belongs to a woman who lived four to five millennia ago buried at Rakhigarhi, the biggest town of the IVC, also known as the Harappan civilization.

Based on their findings, the authors believe that modern South Asians are descended from the Harappan people who later mixed with steppe herders who migrated from the north.

Beyond its academic value, sequencing ancient DNA can help improve modern genome studies that look at genetic predisposition for diseases, a burgeoning area of medicine.

“In Europe, this has been widely studied, and people use these all the time in medical studies, but in South and Central Asia, there’s been a paucity of this — and this paper sort of helps close that gap,” Narasimhan said.

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2...y-illuminates-indo-european-language-origins/

Rad: https://science.sciencemag.org/content/365/6457/eaat7487

Ancient human movements through Asia
Ancient DNA has allowed us to begin tracing the history of human movements across the globe. Narasimhan et al. identify a complex pattern of human migrations and admixture events in South and Central Asia by performing genetic analysis of more than 500 people who lived over the past 8000 years (see the Perspective by Schaefer and Shapiro). They establish key phases in the population prehistory of Eurasia, including the spread of farming peoples from the Near East, with movements both westward and eastward. The people known as the Yamnaya in the Bronze Age also moved both westward and eastward from a focal area located north of the Black Sea. The overall patterns of genetic clines reflect similar and parallel patterns in South Asia and Europe.

Structured Abstract

RATIONALE
To elucidate the extent to which the major cultural transformations of farming, pastoralism, and shifts in the distribution of languages in Eurasia were accompanied by movement of people, we report genome-wide ancient DNA data from 523 individuals spanning the last 8000 years, mostly from Central Asia and northernmost South Asia.

RESULTS
The movement of people following the advent of farming resulted in genetic gradients across Eurasia that can be modeled as mixtures of seven deeply divergent populations. A key gradient formed in southwestern Asia beginning in the Neolithic and continuing into the Bronze Age, with more Anatolian farmer–related ancestry in the west and more Iranian farmer–related ancestry in the east. This cline extended to the desert oases of Central Asia and was the primary source of ancestry in peoples of the Bronze Age Bactria Margiana Archaeological Complex (BMAC). This supports the idea that the archaeologically documented dispersal of domesticates was accompanied by the spread of people from multiple centers of domestication.

The main population of the BMAC carried no ancestry from Steppe pastoralists and did not contribute substantially to later South Asians. However, Steppe pastoralist ancestry appeared in outlier individuals at BMAC sites by the turn of the second millennium BCE around the same time as it appeared on the southern Steppe. Using data from ancient individuals from the Swat Valley of northernmost South Asia, we show that Steppe ancestry then integrated further south in the first half of the second millennium BCE, contributing up to 30% of the ancestry of modern groups in South Asia. The Steppe ancestry in South Asia has the same profile as that in Bronze Age Eastern Europe, tracking a movement of people that affected both regions and that likely spread the unique features shared between Indo-Iranian and Balto-Slavic languages.

The primary ancestral population of modern South Asians is a mixture of people related to early Holocene populations of Iran and South Asia that we detect in outlier individuals from two sites in cultural contact with the Indus Valley Civilization (IVC), making it plausible that it was characteristic of the IVC. After the IVC’s decline, this population mixed with northwestern groups with Steppe ancestry to form the “Ancestral North Indians” (ANI) and also mixed with southeastern groups to form the “Ancestral South Indians” (ASI), whose direct descendants today live in tribal groups in southern India. Mixtures of these two post-IVC groups—the ANI and ASI—drive the main gradient of genetic variation in South Asia today.

CONCLUSION
Earlier work recorded massive population movement from the Eurasian Steppe into Europe early in the third millennium BCE, likely spreading Indo-European languages. We reveal a parallel series of events leading to the spread of Steppe ancestry to South Asia, thereby documenting movements of people that were likely conduits for the spread of Indo-European languages.

F1.large.jpg


The Bronze Age spread of Yamnaya Steppe pastoralist ancestry into two subcontinents—Europe and South Asia.
Pie charts reflect the proportion of Yamnaya ancestry, and dates reflect the earliest available ancient DNA with Yamnaya ancestry in each region. Ancient DNA has not yet been found for the ANI and ASI, so for these the range is inferred statistically.

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Abstract
By sequencing 523 ancient humans, we show that the primary source of ancestry in modern South Asians is a prehistoric genetic gradient between people related to early hunter-gatherers of Iran and Southeast Asia. After the Indus Valley Civilization’s decline, its people mixed with individuals in the southeast to form one of the two main ancestral populations of South Asia, whose direct descendants live in southern India. Simultaneously, they mixed with descendants of Steppe pastoralists who, starting around 4000 years ago, spread via Central Asia to form the other main ancestral population. The Steppe ancestry in South Asia has the same profile as that in Bronze Age Eastern Europe, tracking a movement of people that affected both regions and that likely spread the distinctive features shared between Indo-Iranian and Balto-Slavic languages.
 
Na nacin da je I hg (I2a, I1) autohtona evropska po zvanicnoj nauci genetici i to je apsolutno tacno, ne samo zato sto zvanicno nauka genetika kaze nekim nerazumljivim brojevima i slovima, nego je tacno po principu apsolutne istine, antropologija i lingvistika potvrdjuju genetiku 100% da je I autohtona evropska, I hg bilo gde drugde stize iz evrope i ne moze da bude drugacije.
Живо ме интерусује да ли си ти урадио ДНК анализу?
 
На који начин си то закључио.

https://verenich.wordpress.com/2013/12/27/происхождение-гаплогруппы-i2a-и-путь-миг/amp/

Для примера 2 карты, построенные мной в Меските-Картографере на основании структуры филогенетического дерева из 687 гаплотипов I2a1b-M423, выявленной путем нахождения 20 независимых совпадений 20 лучших (парсимонических) деревьев в TNT. Красным цветом обозначено реконструированное место происхождения — в данном случае это регион Альп.

I2a-Anc


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На реконструированной карте Мескит довольно уверенно определяет место происхождения субклада где-то к северо-востоку от Карпат (обозначено большим красным кругом с красной точкой в центре).

I2a-Ances

Znaci M423 je nastao u ispod Alpa, kod Jadrana, 6000 godina pre Hrista a onda se poceo pomerati prema istoku, pa je 3000 godina pre Hrista nastao Dinaric u Rumuniji?
Sasvim moguce!
 
Poslednja izmena od moderatora:
Sta tebe ima da interesuju moji licni podaci, krvna grupa, haplogrupa...
Ja nisam tema.
Ako budes pisao ovakve komentare da se bavis sa mnom trazicu da se brise.
Питам, јер ако ниси, може да се деси да се изненадиш којој групи припадаш.
То што ја питам не значи да ти мораш да одговориш.
 
Znaci M423 je nastao u ispod Alpa, kod Jadrana, 6000 godina pre Hrista a onda se poceo pomerati prema istoku, pa je 3000 godina pre Hrista nastao Dinaric u Rumuniji?
Sasvim moguce!
Видећемо. Да ли у Молдавији, или горе у Пољској није посебно битно, док не нађемо скелете који ће то да потврде. Пре тога су "обишли" целу Европу и вероватно негде јужно од линије Алпа преживели ледено доба. Не знамо ни којим су језиком говорили.
 
Nešto za one koji pripadaju R1b U152 (Keltskom ogranku R1b) haplogrupi:

12747684_1518706098435600_775530782_n.jpg


Karikatura ima i istorijsku podlogu pošto je egipatski vladar grčkog porekla, Ptolomej II angažovao Kelte iz Galatije u Maloj Aziji i sa Balkana da mu pomognu oko učvršćivanja vlasti i proširenja države.

Many Celtic warriors found a new home in Egypt, married local women and stayed in the land of the Pharaohs for the remainder of their lives. According to the Greek historian Polybios, the intermarriage between Celtic warriors, and native Egyptian and Greek girls were very common. The children of Celtic-Egyptian marriages were known by the slang term e pigovoi.

https://www.ancient-origins.net/history/exploring-little-known-history-celtic-warriors-egypt-005100
 
Zanimljivo, jos kad bi nasli R1b U152 medju danasnjim Egipcanima... :confused:
Postoje neke grane ispod U152, (npr PF6658) koje su zastupljene i kod današnjih Egipćana i Alžiraca, ali te grupe postoje i kod Italijana u priličnoj meri, a vreme života zajedničkog pretka im je nekih 4000-5000 godina od sadašnjeg trenutka, pa se može raditi i o doseljenicima iz bilo kog perioda od tad na ovamo. Nisam naišao na Egipćanina koji ima zajedničkog pretka sa nekim Evropljanom da je vreme života zajedničkog pretka između 2700-2000 godina u odnosu na sadašnji trenutak (kad se radi o ograncima zapadnih haplogrupa; kod istočnih haplotipova je druga stvar)
 
Mislim da bi bilo interesantno analizirati javne osobe koje imaju izgled koji ne pripada tipicno dinarsko- slovensko-mediteranskom tipu.

Meni je recimo Jelena Karelusa veoma neobicna. Koja je ona haplogrupa sta mislite? Cedomir Jovanovic? Aleksandar Vucic takodje izgleda neobicno. Tose Proeski je takodje imao neobicne crte lica.

Da li se to sve meni samo cini????
 
Mislim da bi bilo interesantno analizirati javne osobe koje imaju izgled koji ne pripada tipicno dinarsko- slovensko-mediteranskom tipu.

Meni je recimo Jelena Karelusa veoma neobicna. Koja je ona haplogrupa sta mislite? Cedomir Jovanovic? Aleksandar Vucic takodje izgleda neobicno. Tose Proeski je takodje imao neobicne crte lica.

Da li se to sve meni samo cini????
Kako mogu imati dinarsko-slovenski izgled kad nisu ni dinarci nit sloveni nit Srbi?To sto se neko izjasnjava kao politicki Srbin ne mora da znaci da je to isto genetski i kulturoloski.
 
Мислим да је Вучић I2 али ко зна, тешко га је проценити. Не морају сви да изгледају као типични динарци, вероватно има неке мешавине. Карлеуша, моја процена да јој је отац R1a.
Тоше је нека азијатска група вероватно.

За мене су странци сматрали да сам Шкот, Немац, Италијан и Украјинац (и то од стране Руса), углавном, нико не може да погоди одакле сам. :lol:
 
Мислим да је Вучић I2 али ко зна, тешко га је проценити. Не морају сви да изгледају као типични динарци, вероватно има неке мешавине. Карлеуша, моја процена да јој је отац R1a.
Тоше је нека азијатска група вероватно.

За мене су странци сматрали да сам Шкот, Немац, Италијан и Украјинац (и то од стране Руса), углавном, нико не може да погоди одакле сам. :lol:
Mene je bas pre par meseci (ovde u Kini) jedan covek pitao jesam li Italijanka. :lol:

Za Karleusu je tesko odrediti jer se mnogo sminka tako da ja ni ne znam kako ona izgleda bez sminke. Mnogo se transformise.
 
И мене је у Хонг Конгу пре месец дана у лифту један Грк питао да ли сам Италијан, а Кинез у бусу да ли сам Немац, једна Американка мислила да сам Шкот а Руси у локалној цркви мислили да сам Украјинац. :lol:

Генерално, познате девојке у Србији изгледају доста оријентално због шминке и соларијума, такав је тренд још од 90-их. Углавном странци мисле да су туркиње.
 
Izgled ne odredjuje haplogrupa, postoji autosomalna genetika koja cini oko 98% ukupne ljudske genetike.
Ne postoji tipican srpski izgled, ni tipican italijanski, poljski... Srbi su uglavnom nordijske i dinarske, mediteranske genetike i fenotipa.
Evropljani su genetski homogeni i jako srodni medjusobno, zato i licimo jedni na druge.
Neko bi mogao da kaze da je po izgledu npr. Bogdan Diklic iz Norveske...
Moj deda je veoma licio na rezisera Milos Formana, a njegov brat je izgledao gotovo identicno kao glumac Victor Sjöström.
I moj deda i njegov brat su etnicki Srbi po svim prababama i padedama.
 
Мислим да је Вучић I2 али ко зна, тешко га је проценити. Не морају сви да изгледају као типични динарци, вероватно има неке мешавине. Карлеуша, моја процена да јој је отац R1a.
Тоше је нека азијатска група вероватно.

За мене су странци сматрали да сам Шкот, Немац, Италијан и Украјинац (и то од стране Руса), углавном, нико не може да погоди одакле сам. :lol:

Тоше је рођен у цинцарској породици у Крушеву (Крушево је некад имало цинцарску већину, а данас је македонизирано).
Вучко има цинцарско поријекло по мушкој линији. Вучко је врв. R1b-BY611. Чипуљић код Бугојна оклен је Вучков ћаћа је цинцарско село, једно од два у Босни (било је и једно код Брчког).

Тоше пјева на цинцарском.
 
Moja mtDNA haplogrupa: H5a.

Subclade H5a

The one known subclade of H5 is H5a, defined by T4336C in the control region, which has its own subclades of H5a1 and H5a2. H5a is thought to be around 7000–8000 years old, in other words, the mutation T4336C probably occurred c. 5500 BC. It is fairly evenly distributed at low levels across Europe. The average in samples from Austria, Germany, Hungary, Macedonia, and Romania was 2.4%. Yet it is almost absent from the Caucasus and the Near East, suggesting a European origin. Although it was initially thought to have its highest level on the central European plain, more recent research has shown the highest levels in Iberia, the Balkans and Finno-Scandia. The British Isles was excluded from the latter study, but the former showed that H5a does occur there.

Álvarez-Iglesias et al. observed a frequency peak for H5a in the Franco-Cantabrian region decreasing towards East Europe and commented that "This is compatible with a process of demographic repopulation of Europe after the LGM period centered in this climatic and geographic refuge." However such a scenario would be too early for the date of c. 5500 BC. calculated by Luísa Pereira, Martin Richards, Ana Goios, et al. So a later dissemination across Europe would appear more likely if the dating is correct.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haplogroup_H5_(mtDNA)
 

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