Vuciji narod Evrope

dublin · 22.03.2013. u 10:19

Interesantno. Jako interesantno.

Medjutim ja jos uvek nisam siguran na koji su nacin sabinjani i etrurci povezani. Da jesu pokazuje to sto su kraljevi rima bili ili sabinjani ili etrurci. Svi rani rimski bogovi su ili sabinski ili etrurski. Ja znam za radove koji su povezivali etrurce sa Srbima. Sad vidimo da Sabinjane mozemo povezati sa Srbima. Ja mislim da je vuciji kult ono sto razdvaja ova dva naroda. On je definitivno bio glavna religija sabinskog vucijeg naroda. Koliko je bio rasiren medju etrurcima ne znam. Vidim da je postojao i kod Veneta. Voleo bih kad bi mi neko pomogao u istrazivanju.

dublin · 22.03.2013. u 11:51

sad kad znam sve ovo o sabinima i kad vidimo da su sabini, osnivaci rima, dosli sa balkana, i da su potomci pelagza, postaju mi jasniji radovi odiseja belcevskog o makedonskom (pelaskom slovenskom srpskom sabinskom) poreklu mnogih grckih i latinskih reci, pojmova i imena bogova.

O slovenskom korenu mnogih grckih i latinskih reci koje etimoloski recnici "ne mogu da objasne". par primera.

Etymology

understanding of the word “Etymology” itself according to the Oxford dictionary [13] definition, etymology is defined as “origin and development of a word in form and sense, account of this; study of origins of words.” The Online Etymology dictionary points to the meaning of etymology in its relationship to the greek word ethumo εθυμο,“the true meaning of a word.” If, however, we conduct a
deeper search into the true meaning of ethumo, we discover that it is not greek in origin, but rather foreign to attic prose, used only by Plato in a quotation in the Cratylus, where he ‘attacks’ the works of the Ionian philosophers (indicating Phrygia). The Phrygians were an ancient people known to the greeks as ‘barbarians’, originally from ancient Macedonia. They established their empire in asia Minor (1200-800 BC). Their language has not been clearly deciphered, but a large number of words belong to the slavic substrate, including the actual ‘name’ which can be related to the slavic word breg > bregi, a geographical name for edge (i.e. edge of a sea or lake). In Modern greek, ethumo εθυμο does not exist on its own, which in fact strongly indicates that the word has been borrowed by greek from an earlier European language. since the word and its derivatives and relations could not be identified in the latin or germanic group of languages, I initiated a search for possible slavic connections, particularly
within the older Macedonian dialects, which revealed that the word ethumo is related to the Macedonian words дума (duma) > думо (dumo)> умо (umo) which equate with word, thought and mind. delving into the homeric realm, I discovered that the south slavic duma is very close in meaning to the ancient word dumo > thumo θυμο, d > th >θ. according to g. Curtius [14], the ancient Macedonians frequently changed the sound θ to d or t. The word θυμο, as pointed out by E. Maltby [15], means mind or soul. We find the same in other homeric words and expressions, such as thumalgi > dumalk meaning distressing the mind and dumo e moi meaning the thought is mine. further analysis of the south slavic words umo (the mind) dumo > duma (a word, thought, to think), reveals that they are firmly based in the same root word, um > umo (the mind).

Forum

The current etymology of this word given by the Online Etymology dictionary [12] states that forum is from the latin word forum meaning out of doors, market place, place of assembly in ancient Rome. The sense of assembly, place for public discussion was first 21 recorded in 1690. however this does not give a true meaning of this word and we need to go back to earlier times of language development.
With analysis of basic things associated with the word forum, given by the Online Etymology dictionary [12] in relation to out of doors we come to the fundamental fact that it is related to the space outside. Everything that is formal today is basically exposed to the public. all activities that are considered formal are exposed to the outside world, literally for the world or all the people in a community to see and acknowledge. Therefore this connects to and provides an easily understandable and acceptable etymology to the words formal and formality. With knowledge of the slavic languages and their analysis we can see that the word forum is part of a conceptual creation. It belongs to a large concept associated with open space, and the outside, that today still exists in the slavic domain. It is part of a very large number of related words and concepts in slavic. In fact the Macedonian word двор (dvor) meaning outside, open space, yard, is conceptually connected to the word otfor (Macedonian отфор
(otfor), serbian otvor) meaning opening and further to стфор (stvor) > стфорен (stvoren) literally meaning what is created and exists in the outside, in the world.In Macedonian this is clearly defined as стфори (stfori) >стфорен (stforen) literally meaning brought out, created. Therefore the Macedonian на двор (na dvor) > dvor > dvoro> dvorum meaning outside, in the open, open space is functionally related to otfor, otvor, otvara,(f↔v) meaning opening, to open. humans live in enclosed entities, structures such as houses. In order to move from an enclosed structure to the outside or from outside space to an enclosed space, humans created openings, which brings us to the basic meaning of door > outdoors. This is confirmed with the homeric Pelasgian word dvoura δφουρα meaning door (the sound v is dropped) literally meaning what is leading to the outside, in the open, or what leads from one space to another.

i tako dalje...

http://www.korenine.si/zborniki/zbornik10/belchevsky_slavic_roots.pdf

O slovenskom korenu grcke mitologije

It was Plato (500-600 BC) that said “most gods and their traditions we have received from the Barbarians.” A few hundred years later Herodotus confirms Plato’s statement.

http://macedonian.blogspot.ie/2004/12/classical-mythology-explained-with-use.html

Water - Wota - Woda - Voda
Water (Voda) conceptually derives its name because it is a liquid and moves.
When we pour it, it takes the lead or moves ahead and creates its own path.
By simply observing nature we see that rivers move and flow. These rivers,
if large enough, are used as natural paths and roadways.

In Macedonian this word is important and at the root of the concepts of
movement and leading as well as other related words. This is the "key" that
unlocks the meaning of many other words and concepts.
Voda (Water) relates to vodi meaning to lead or to carry.

>From here we have odi - to go, to travel, to move. This contains two
fundamental word particles in Macedonian that indicate movement or
displacement.

These are: "od" (from), and "do" (to) and together they create oddo (od +
do) that again leads to "odi" meaning to go, to travel, to move. These
particles are always used when describing movement, from one point to
another.

Thus we get the following:

Voda - vadi, vade, navadi, livada (a moist or green pasture).
Note here the English term "wade" which means to move in water.
Vodi - to lead
Vodach - leader
Voditel - leader
Vodici - Holy day associated with water
Vodenje - leading
Voden, Vodensko, etc., place names of wet regions
Navodni, navadi - to water
Uvod - the beginning and summary of a book
Navod - to bring forward
Uvedi - to bring into a record

The Concept of Movement

The concept of movement has developed from water:

Voda, Vodi = V + Odi
Odi, ode, ojde, ajde, otide, ide, idi

I have found the verb form idi (iti) in the Homeric poems dating back to
1500 BC.

Doide - came
Sjoide - went
Po-odi(e)- short walk

>From here we can explain the meanings of many other words, for example:

Odometer - Odo = to move or go + Meter = to measure. In Macedonian
(odomeri).
In electricity we have terms like, Anode. "An" is old Macedonian word for
"Na" (Nad) meaning on or above + ode = go, move. Thus anode is explained as
to go above or bring above.

Cathode - In Macedonian we have k'ti, kutni = bring down, + ode = go, move.
Thus cathode is explained as to go down or to bring down.

Itinerary - has the Macedonian verb Idi (iti) = go, move, travel, as well as
the noun idenje = traveling.

If we turn briefly to Greek we can see that the Greek language has borrowed
from this large family /concept the word -"Odos "- street and "odeo" to
travel, mainly found in the Homeric poems. However this concept of movement
simply does not exist in Greek, English or many other European languages
(Except in the Slavonic languages).

Unfortunately, the Oxford and Webster authorities have referred to many of
these words as "Greek" without any convincing proof as to their roots or
families.

http://sci.tech-archive.net/Archive/sci.lang/2005-04/msg00811.html

dublin · 22.03.2013. u 12:54

jos par stvari vezanih za kralja numu pompilusa

Numa was said to have authored several "sacred books" in which he had written down divine teachings, mostly from Egeria and the Muses. Plutarch[7] (citing Valerius Antias) and Livy[8] records that at his request he was buried along with these "sacred books", preferring that the rules and rituals they prescribed be preserved in the living memory of the state priests, rather than preserved as relics subject to forgetfulness and disuse. About half of these books—Plutarch and Livy differ on their number—were thought to cover the priesthoods he had established or developed, including the flamines, pontifices, Salii, and fetiales and their rituals. The other books dealt with philosophy (disciplina sapientiae). According to Plutarch,[7] these books were recovered some four hundred years later (in reality almost five hundred years, i. e. in 186 BC according to Livy) at the occasion of a natural accident that exposed the tomb. They were examined by the Senate, deemed to be inappropriate for disclosure to the people, and burned. Dionysius of Halicarnassus[9] hints that they were actually kept as a very close secret by the pontifices.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Numa_Pompilius

Kaze se da je Numa napisao nekoliko "svetih" knjiga u kojima je opisao ili propisao religijske obicaje originalnih rimljana (vucijeg naroda sabinjana). Takodje je u njima opisao rimsko (sabinsko) shvatanje sveta. Po njegovom zahtevu ove knjige su sahranjene sa njim, jer je on zeleo da se ova znanja prenesu kroz religiozne institucije rima. Po Liviju ove knjige su "otkrivene" (izvadjene iz groba?) petsto godina kasnije (186. godine pre nove ere) posto je neka prirodna nepogoda otkrila Numin grob. Numine knjige su pregledane od strane senata koji je odlucio da nisu podobne za objavljivanje obicnom narodu, i knjige su spaljene. Dionysius pak tvrdi da su knjige ustvari sakrivene i cuvane kao najstroza tajna od strane pontifa, svestenika rimske drzavne religije, cuvara svetih knjiga, istih onih koji su po Numi trebali da sacuvaju njegova ucenja. Sta je bilo u ovim knjigama? Ocigledno nesto sto bi do temelja uzdrmalo lazni anti sabinski rim kasnog republikanskog perioda.

The College of Pontiffs (Latin Collegium Pontificum; see collegium) was a body of the ancient Roman state whose members were the highest-ranking priests of the state religion...

During the Regal Period of Roman history, the pontiffs were primarily concilia (advisers) of the kings, but after the expulsion of the last Roman King Lucius Tarquinius Superbus in 510 BC, the College of Pontiffs became religious advisers to the Roman Senate. As the most important of the four priestly colleges, the college of pontiffs’ duties involved advising the senate on issues pertaining to the gods, the supervision of the calendar and thus the supervision of ceremonies with their specific rituals, and the appeasement of the gods upon the appearance of prodigies.
One of their most important duties was their guardianship of the libri pontificales, or pontifical books. Among these were the acta, indigitamenta (lists of invocations or names of deities), ritualia, commentarii, fasti, and annales (yearly records of magistrates and important events). These items were under the sole possession of the college of pontiffs and only they were allowed to consult these items when necessary.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/College_of_Pontiffs

Ono sto je jako interesantno je da je prvi rimski imperator Augustus obnovio mnoge Sabinske kultove pa i kult Nume Pompilusa.

ovaj novcic je pravljen u vreme avgustovog vladanja.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Augustus

Augustus (Latin: Imperator Caesar Divi F. Augustus,[note 1] 23 September 63 BC – 19 August 14 AD) was the founder of the Roman Empire and its first Emperor, ruling from 27 BC until his death in 14 AD.[note 2] Born into an old, wealthy equestrian branch of the plebeian Octavii family, in 44 BC Augustus was adopted posthumously by his maternal great-uncle Gaius Julius Caesar following Caesar's assassination. Together with Mark Antony and Marcus Lepidus, he formed the Second Triumvirate to defeat the assassins of Caesar.

Avgust je bio pripadnik stare "konjicke" aristokratije.

The Roman equestrian order (aka "Roman Order of Knights" Latin: ordo equester) constituted the lower of the two aristocratic classes of ancient Rome, ranking below the patricians (patricii), a hereditary caste that monopolized political power during the regal era (to 501 BC) and during the early Republic (to 338 BC). A member of the equestrian order was known as an eques (plural: equites).
During the Roman kingdom and the 1st century of the Republic, legionary cavalry was recruited exclusively from the ranks of the patricians, who were expected to provide 6 centuriae of cavalry (300 horses for each consular legion). Around 400 BC, 12 more centuriae of cavalry were established and these included non-patricians (plebeians). Around 300 BC the Samnite Wars obliged Rome to double the normal annual military levy from 2 to 4 legions, doubling the cavalry levy from 600 to 1,200 horse. Legionary cavalry started to recruit wealthier citizens from outside the 18 centuriae. These new recruits came from the First Class of commoners in the centuriate organisation and were not granted the same privileges.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Equestrian_order

Ova konjicka aristokratija, rimski vitezovi konjanici, su bili druga po vaznosti aristokratska klasa starog rima (odmah iza patricija) koja je zajedno sa patricijama vladala za vreme kraljevine i rane republike (do 338 godine pre nove ere). Clan ovog viteskog reda je bio poznat kao eques. Za vreme kraljevine i prvih sto godina repoublike, konjanicke legije rima su regrutovane iskljucivo iz redova patricija, sto znaci da je originalno ovaj konjicki red bio vojno krilo vlasti cije su svestenicko (politicko) krilo bili patricijski religijski redovi poput arvalskog bratsva.

Ovo je jako jako vazno.

Za romulusa se kaze da je osnovao religijsko Arvalsko bratstvo koje je bazirano na bratstvu Titii (ili je bilo jedno te isto).
Za romulusa se takodje kaze da je osnova Celeres (sto znaci brzi), svoju telesnu gardu koja je brojala 300 ljudi, za koju se pretpostavlja da je bila konjica. Ova jedinica je bila stajaca vojska (pretorijanska garda) koja je bila jedinstvena u to vreme.

Interesantno je da se za Numu tvrdi da je prvo sto je uradio kad je dosao na vlast, je da je raspustio Celeres.

According to Plutarch, Numa's first act was to disband the personal guard of 300 so-called "Celeres" (the "Swift") with which Romulus permanently surrounded himself.[4] The gesture is variously interpreted as self-protection in the face of their questionable loyalty, a sign of humility, or a signal of peace and moderation.

The Celeres were a personal armed guard of 300-500 men maintained by Romulus, the mythical founder of ancient Rome. The Celeres were associated with Celer, the lieutenant of Romulus responsible for Remus' slaying in some stories. Livy mentions that they served in peacetime and in war, unlike the short terms of service in most ancient armies (including Rome's). It is unknown whether they were infantry or cavalry; Dionysius claims the former, while Livy and other sources argue that the Celeres were a cavalry unit. The latter seems more plausible given that celeres means literally "the swift".

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Celeres

Da li je ovo trag korena ove konjicke aristokratije? Da li ih je osnovao, a ne rasformirao, Numa? Da li je ovo koren kasnijih slovenskih gardi od pretorijanske garde koja je klicala "Gay je ser, Gay je ser" (gaj je gospodin, gospodar, Servius, ili sto bi se na srpskom reklo gajje srbine) sto je postalo kajjeser - kajser - ćeser - ćesar - kajzer - cezar (rimljani su izgovara kajser), do varangijske garde do slovenske garde spanskog kalifata...

Da li je ovo jos jedan dokaz postojanja Srpske (Sabinske, slovenske) konjicke aristokratije koja pod znakom vuka i orla (nocnog i dnevnog sunca) vladala rimom?

Takodje da li je ovo pokazatelj da je u rimu za vreme republike doslo do prevrata u kome su sabini izgubili vlast 338. godine pre nove ere, i da su vlast povratili sa cezarom i avgustom i ukidanjem republika i stvaranjem imperije? Puno pitanja, puno mogucnosti...

dublin · 22.03.2013. u 16:18

Lesandar pogledaj ovo u vezi Rume:

According to Roman legend, Rome was founded by its first king, Romulus, in 753 BC. However, archaeological evidence suggests that Rome did not acquire the character of a unified city-state (as opposed to a number of separate hilltop settlements) until ca. 625 BC.[1]

Dakle ovo pada u period vladavine Sabinskih kraljeva odnosno tacno pre pocetka vladavine prvog etrurskog kralja Lucuisa (Vuka) Tarquiniusa Priscusa.

Takodje ovo je interesantno u vezi rimske konjicke aristokratije (Vitezova):

Roman tradition relates that the Order of Knights was founded by Romulus, who supposedly established a cavalry regiment of 300 men called the Celeres ("the Swift Squadron") to act as his personal escort, with each of the three Roman "tribes" (actually voting constituencies) supplying 100 horse. This cavalry regiment was supposedly doubled in size to 600 men by King Tarquinius Priscus (traditional dates 616-578 BC).[2] That the cavalry was increased to 600 during the regal era is plausible, as in the early Republic the cavalry fielded remained 600-strong (2 legions with 300 horse each).[3] However, according to Livy, king Servius Tullius (traditional reign-dates 578-535 BC) established a further 12 centuriae of equites, a further tripling of the cavalry.[4] But this is probably anachronistic, as it would have resulted in a contingent of 1,800 horse, incongruously large, compared to the heavy infantry, which was probably only 6,000-strong in the late regal period. Instead, the additional 12 centuriae were probably created at a later stage, perhaps around 400 BC, but these new units were political not military, most likely designed to admit plebeians to the Order of Knights.[5]
Apparently, equites were originally provided with a sum of money by the state to purchase a horse for military service and for its fodder. This was known as an equus publicus.[6]
Mommsen argues that the royal cavalry was drawn exclusively from the ranks of the Patricians (patricii), the aristocracy of early Rome, which was purely hereditary.[7] Apart from the traditional association of the aristocracy with horsemanship, the evidence for this view is the fact that, during the Republic, 6 centuriae (voting constituencies) of equites in the comitia centuriata (electoral assembly) retained the names of the original 6 royal cavalry centuriae.[6][Note 1] These are very likely "the centuriae of patrician nobles" in the comitia mentioned by the lexicologist Festus. If this view is correct, it implies that the cavalry was exclusively patrician (and therefore hereditary) in the regal period. (However, Cornell considers the evidence tenuous).[8]

Dakle "romulus" je organizovao 300 vitezova, tri puta po sto, tri satnije, centurije gde je svaku satniju davalo jedno od originalna tri plemena (Tribe odnosno thri bhve). Kasnije je prvi etrurski kralj Lucius Tarquinius Priscus povecao broj na 600.

Ovaj broj 300 je interesantan.

In other Roman institutions established by Numa, Plutarch thought he detected a Laconian influence, attributing the connection to the Sabine culture of Numa, for "Numa was descended of the Sabines, who declare themselves to be a colony of the Lacedaemonians."

Plutarh kaze da su sabini za sebe tvrdili da su poreklom Spartanci.

The Persian army seems to have made slow progress through Thrace and Macedon. News of the imminent Persian approach eventually reached Greece in August thanks to a Greek spy.[32] At this time of year the Spartans, de facto military leaders of the alliance, were celebrating the festival of Carneia. During the Carneia, military activity was forbidden by Spartan law; the Spartans had arrived too late at the Battle of Marathon because of this requirement.[33] It was also the time of the Olympic Games, and therefore the Olympic truce, and thus it would have been doubly sacrilegious for the whole Spartan army to march to war.[33][34] On this occasion, the ephors decided the urgency was sufficiently great to justify an advance expedition to block the pass, under one of its kings, Leonidas I. Leonidas took with him the 300 men, all that he was allowed, of the royal bodyguard, the Hippeis, and a larger number of support troops, including 1,000 Phoceans, drawn from other parts of Lacedaemon (including helots).[34] This expedition was to try to gather as many other Greek soldiers along the way as possible, and to await the arrival of the main Spartan army.[34]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Thermopylae

Dakle za vreme glavne spartanske slave koja se zvala Carneia bilo je zabranjeno spartancima koristiti vojsku osim 300 kraljevskih telohranitelja Hippeis...

Carnea (Ancient Greek: Κάρνεια, Karneia, or Κάρνεα, Karnea) was the name of one of the great national festivals of Sparta, held in honour of Apollo Carneus...The Carnea appears to have been at once agrarian, military and piacular in character.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carneia

Carnea je bila spartanska slava posvecena ovcijem apolu. Ovaj festival je u isto vreme imao poljoprivredni, vojni i kao i piacular (zlocinacki, pokvaren) karakter...Dakle ovde se slavio poljoprivredno vojni bog koji je bio jedna od emanacija apola. istog onog apola koji je bio poznat kao vuciji apolo (Apollo Lyceus Apollo “the wolf-god"). Vuciji i Ovciji apolo...

http://www.iep.utm.edu/lyceum/

(Κάρνεια, Κάρνειος, Κάρνος; Kárneia, Kárneios, Kárnos). The C. was a standard Dorian midsummer festival dedicated to Apollo Carneus (to the ‘ram’-Apollo, cf. Hsch. s.v. κάρνος ... πρόβατον) with musical agons (Hellanicus of Lesbos, FGrH 4 F 85). It was allegedly institutionalized in 676/3 BC (Sosibius, FGrH 595 F 3). Part of the festival was the sacrifice of a ram: in Theocritus (5,82f.) a shepherd raises a choice ram just for the C. The epithet Carneus did not belong solely to Apollo, but also to Zeus (in Argos: schol. Theoc. 5,83bd);

Carneus (ovciji) je takodje bio epitet Zeusa, vucijeg zevsa iz arkadije koja je bila severni sused sparte.

Dakle Spartanci slave poljoprivredno - ratnickog boga isto kao i rimljani u zevsu querinusu i imaju 300 kraljevskih telohranitelja isto kao i sabini koji tvrde da poticu od spartanaca...

Lesandar · 22.03.2013. u 19:07

Imam još jedan podatak o Tarkvinijusu Priskusu, naime,Bartold Georg Niburg kaže da ga je otac Tarčon kao dete doneo iz Mezije. Tu se može naslutiti čvršća veza sa imenom Tračani, koje je, po meni metatezirano.

dublin · 24.03.2013. u 00:13

lesandar sve vodi prema balkanu, oblasti ispod save i dunava a to ukljucuje i trakiju. To je teritorija vince, pa kasnije trakije, tesalije, pelagzije, makedonije...To je i rodno mesto slovena.

pogledaj ovo

Teritorija pelasga po raznim izvorima:

Grad Larisa je bila kraljevsko sediste pelaske tesalije. Kaze se da je bilo vise Larisa i da Larisa na pelaskom znaci Tvrdjava. Lar na irskom znaci centar. An Lar je centar grada. Larissa ili Larica je centar, naselje....Jako interesantno

Larisa je po predanju takodje i nimfa (vila) cerka kralja Pelasgusa.

Tesalijsku larisu su osnovali pripadnici Aleuadai klana koje je herodot zvao kraljevima tesalije. Prvi Aleuas, koji je imao nadimak Pyrrhos (Πύρρος), sto znaci crvenokosi je bio kralj, Tagus, tesalije i potomak Heraclesa preko Thessalusa. Na novcu Larise su konji, koji su bili simbol tesalije koja je bila poznata po konjima i konjici. Tesalijska konjica je bila druga najbolja konjica starog sveta posle makedonske konjice. Interesantno je da da je elitna makedonska konjica Hetairoi (Ἑταῖροι), bila regrutovana iz redova aristokratije i da je kraljevski eskadron imao 300 konjanika??? Isto kao Romulovih (Numinih) 300 Celeres vitezova. Kaze se da se u Aleuasa zaljubila zmija koja mu je podarila mudrost i znanje jezika ptica i sposobnost proricanja sudbine iz leta ptica. U rimu je glavni nacin proricanja sudbine bio iz leta ptica i ovaj obred su izvrsavali Auguri koji su bili Etrurski (Sabinski) svestenici. Prvi opis "inauguracije", cinatanja volje bogova iz leta ptica, je bio cin krunisanja Nume Pompilusa. Auguri su procitali da Luppiter (Jupiter) zeli da Numa postane kralj Rima iz leta ptica. Larisa se spominje u homerovoj ilijadi. Homer kaze da je Hippothous vodio plemena pelaskih kopljanika? Kaze se da su ljudi iz larise bili pelasgi i da su bili cuveni kopljanici. U ilijadi se takodje govori o Pelaskom Argosu (Thessaly) gde zivi "Pelasgic Zeus", koji vlada Dodonom, svetilistem u Epirusu. U Odiseji, Odisej, koji kaze da je kricanin, takodje kaze da pelasgi zive na kritu zajedno sa minojcima. Dakle imamo vezu tesaliju, pelasge, konjanike kopljanike koji obozavaju zevsa vucijeg boga kao i aresa boga rata kopljanika i koji proricu iz leta ptica. Onda imamo sabinjane konjanike kopljanike koji obozavaju quirinusa Luppitera (vucijeg boga) i Marsa quirinusa (boga rata kopljanika) i koji proricu iz leta ptica...

I imamo grad Laricu i Irce kod kojih Lar znaci centar...I kod kojih je koplje sveto...I koji su slavili Crom Duba, hromog dabu, vucijeg boga i njegovog sina Luga boga kopljanika????

Interesnatno.

U sledecem postu cu dati navode.

dublin · 24.03.2013. u 00:16

According to Greek mythology it is said that the city of Larisa was founded by Acrisius, who was killed accidentally by his grandson, Perseus.[3] There lived Peleus, the hero beloved by the gods, and his son Achilles. In mythology, the nymph Larissa was a daughter of the primordial man Pelasgus.[4]

The name Larissa (Λάρισα Lárīsa) is in origin a Pelasgian (pre-Greek) word for "fortress". There were many ancient Greek cities with this name.[7] The name of Thessalian Larissa is first recorded in connection with the aristocratic Aleuadai family.[8]

The Aleuadae (Ancient Greek: Ἀλευάδαι) were an ancient Thessalian family of Larissa who claimed descent from the mythical Aleuas.[1][2] The Aleuadae were the noblest and most powerful among all the families of Thessaly, whence Herodotus calls its members "rulers" or "kings" (βασιλεῖς).[3][4]

The first Aleuas,[5] who bore the epithet of Pyrrhos (Πύρρος), that is, "red-haired", is called king, or Tagus, of Thessaly, and a descendant of Heracles through Thessalus. Aelian recorded the myth of how he became a divinely-inspired seer, in the fashion of a gift from a serpent: while he was tending sheep on the slopes of Mount Ossa, a serpent became enamored of him, kissed his hair, licked his face and brought him gifts.[11] According to the Bibliotheca, a grateful brood of serpents, in return for his having erected a funeral pyre for their serpent-mother, purified his ears with their tongues, so that he might understand the language of birds, and interpret their flight in augury.

Na irskom Lar znaci centar. Da li se ovde govori o mesanju "dananaca, danajaca, iraca" i pelasga? Zna se da su Danaanci dosli u pelasku kraljevinu od preko mora i da su preuzeli vlast. Ti isti Danaanci, sinovi boginje dane, su se kasnije pojavili u irskoj???? Da li neko ima nesto da kaze po ovom pitanju?

The augur was a priest and official in the classical world, especially ancient Rome and Etruria. His main role was to interpret the will of the gods by studying the flight of birds. The prototype of the ritual of inauguration of people is described in Livy's[19] relation of the inauguration of king Numa Pompilius. The augur asks Jupiter (signa belong to Jupiter): "Si fas est (i.e. if it is divine justice to do this)... send me a certain signum (sign)", then the augur listed the auspicia he wanted to see coming. When they appeared Numa was declared king.

The horse was an appropriate symbol of Thessaly, a land of plains, which was well known for its horses. Usually there is a male figure; he should perhaps be seen as the eponymous hero of the Thessalians, Thessalos, who is probably also to be identified on many of the earlier, federal coins of Thessaly.

The Thessalians were considered the finest cavalry of Greece.

The Companion cavalry, or Hetairoi (Ἑταῖροι), were the elite arm of the Macedonian army, and have been regarded as the best cavalry[6] in the ancient world. Along with Thessalian cavalry contingents, the Companions—raised from landed nobility—made up the bulk of the Macedonian heavy cavalry. Hetairoi were divided into squadrons called ilai (singular: ilē), each 200 men strong, except for the Royal Squadron, which numbered 300.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Larissa
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Larisa_(Troad)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aleuadae
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ancient_Macedonian_army#Thessalian_Cavalry
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Augur

The city of Larissa is mentioned in Book II of Iliad by Homer: Hippothous led the tribes of Pelasgian spearsmen, who dwelt in fertile Larissa- Hippothous,and Pylaeus of the race of Mars, two sons of the Pelasgian Lethus, son of Teutamus. [5] [/B]

B]The Pelasgians first appear in the poems of Homer: those who are stated to be Pelasgians in the Iliad are among the allies of Troy.Homer calls their town or district "Larisa"[/B][12] and characterises it as fertile, and its inhabitants as celebrated for their spearsmanship.
In the Odyssey, Odysseus, affecting to be Cretan himself, instances Pelasgians among the tribes in the ninety cities of Crete, "language mixing with language side by side".[13]
The Iliad also refers to "Pelasgic Argos",[14] which is most likely to be the plain of Thessaly,[15] and to "Pelasgic Zeus", living in and ruling over Dodona,[16] which must be the oracular one in Epirus.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pelasgians

The god could also be invoked from a distance. In Homer's Iliad (circa 750 BCE),[11] Achilles prays to "High Zeus, Lord of Dodona, Pelasgian, living afar off, brooding over wintry Dodona".[12]

Zeus was raised by a goat named Amalthea, while a company of Kouretes— soldiers, or smaller gods— danced, shouted and clashed their spears against their shields so that Cronus would not hear the baby's cry (see cornucopia).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Zeus

In classical Greek mythology Zeus' bolts of lightning may be interpreted as a symbolic spear. Some would carry that interpretation to the spear that frequently is associated with Athena, interpreting her spear as a symbolic connection to some of Zeus' power beyond the Aegis once he rose to replacing other deities in the pantheon. Athena was depicted with a spear prior to that change in myths, however. Chiron's wedding-gift to Peleus when he married the nymph Thetis in classical Greek mythology, was an ashen spear as the nature of ashwood with its straight grain made it an ideal choice of wood for a spear.

The Celts would symbolically destroy a dead warrior's spear either to prevent its use by another or as a sacrificial offering.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spear

Lugh or Lug (/luɣ/; modern Irish: Lú /lu:/) is an Irish deity represented in mythological texts as a hero and High King of the distant past. He is known by the epithets Lámhfhada (pronounced /'la:wad̪ˠə/, meaning "long arm" or "long hand"), for his skill with a spear or sling,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lugh

Ares, exceeding in strength, chariot-rider, golden-helmed, doughty in heart, shield-bearer, Saviour of cities, harnessed in bronze, strong of arm, unwearying, mighty with the spear. He is one of the Twelve Olympians, and the son of Zeus and Hera.[1]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ares

Quirinus was originally most likely a Sabine god of war. Quirinus is probably an adjective meaning "wielder of the spear". A. B. Cook (Class. Rev. xviii., p. 368) explains Quirinus as the oak-god (quercus), and Quirites as the men of the oaken spear.[3]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quirinus

The spear is the instrument of Mars

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mars_(mythology)

Juno (Latin: Iūno [ˈjuːno]) is an ancient Roman goddess, the protector and special counselor of the state. She is also known as Curitis (spear holder).

Curitis was originally a Sabine Goddess of Protection who especially guarded or watched over the clans of the people. Curitis was depicted as a martial Goddess who carried a spear and shield, and who wore a goat-skin mantle much like the aegis of the Greek myth, which was a short goat-skin cape or shield probably symbolic of the thunderclouds, as the spear was of the lightning. Curitis's name is from the Sabine word curis and means "Of the Spear"; in addition to its stormy associations, the spear was also seen as representing authority or command, emphasizing Her role as the ruling Goddess. In Rome, Juno Curitis was considered the Goddess of the curiae, the political, religious, and familial divisions or clans of the people of Rome. Curia most likely derived from the same Sabine word curis, "spear", as the Goddess's name; and a related word quirite, "spearman" or "warrior", was used of the oldest tribal peoples of Rome.

dublin · 25.03.2013. u 13:03

Iz irskog recnika

Lar - Centar
Ri - Kralj
Sa - sufix koji potvrdjuje znacenje

Lar Ri Sa = Istinski Prestoni grad, Pravi Centar Kraljevine, Nas vladarski centar, Centar nase kraljevine....

primeri:

Conri: (KAWN-ree) Old Irish=cu (con) "hound, wolf" + ri "king." An early recorded men's name. Conroy.

Old Irish

-sa myself (emphatic) Usage: Added to nouns to emphasize a first-person singular possessor, to verbs to emphasize a first-person singular subject, and to inflected prepositions to emphasize a first-person singular object:

Bíuu-sa oc irbáig dar far cenn-si fri Maccidóndu.
"I (emph.) am boasting about you to the Macedonians."

Ovo u vezi imean Conri (izgovara se Konri) je interesantno. Prvo Con dolazi od staro irskog Cu (izgovara se Ku) sto moze da znaci lovacki vojni pas i vuk i vuciji pas.

The name Irish wolfhound is quite a recent one but the hound itself goes back far into the mists of time. It is mentioned, as cú (variously translated as hound, Irish hound, war dog, wolf dog, etc.) in Irish laws, which predate Christianity, and in Irish literature which dates from the 5th century or, in the case of the Sagas, from the old Irish period - AD600-900. Only kings and the nobility were allowed to own the great Irish hound, the numbers permitted depending on position.

http://www.irishwolfhounds.org/history.htm

Ovo je jako interesantno jer mi na srpskom imamo rec Ku koja znaci pas. Ku-ce je muski pas, Ku-ja je zenski pas. I u srpskoj mitologiji se pas i vuk izjednacavaju ali ne bilo koji pas vec pas zmaj, vojni vuciji pas, vodic srpskog plemena. Zbog ovoga je kod srba zmaj ustvari vuciji pas, vuk. Evo sta sam o ovome pisao pre dosta vremena na temi o zmajevima:

Ovde se govori o zmajevima u srpskoj tradiciji. tradicionalna upotreba zmajeva kao simbola je jako stara i vezana je za sarmate i kao sto mozes da vidis dacane a i za arturijanske legende za koje se danas smatra da su sarmatske. Svi izvori govore o tome da su ti zmajevi imali psece glave, ili glave koje lice na psece (psoglavi zmajevi). a kod nas u zakoniku o rasama se upravo detaljno objasnjava da su zmajevi ustvari psi i govori se o iskonskoj tradiciji ovih ratnih pasa u srba.
Pitanje koje se namece je sarmati - dacani - artur - srbi - psoglavi zmajevi - red zmaja - transilvanija - drakul - madjarska
Kakva je veza izmaedju svega ovoga? Kako to da se samo u zakoniku o rasama daje detaljni opis zmajeva? Ako cela prica o psoglavim zmajevima pocinje sa sarmatima, pa ide preko dacana do srba i madjara, da li je red zmaja uopste bio srpski, ili su srbi bili samo clanovi? itd. puno pitanja.

Sada vidim da su u pitanju Vuciji Psi, Vukovi boga Daboga, Hromog dabe.

Овај законик да се свима жто држе змајеве у ум постави и довјека поштује, јер змајеви су уз нас од давнина, од прије него што смо и слово имали, па их ваља поштовати и чувати, јер су од Бога. Као што нас без змајева не би ни било, тако нас без змајева неће ни бити. Свако лето је Господње.

Законик Расе, чија се старост (према начину писања и самоме псу) процењује на XII или XIII век. Предање је да га је писао један Цар, а једини Цар тога доба који је имао везе са династијом Немањића, и са витешким Редом Црвеног Змаја био је Цар Стефан Душан. Не знамо да ли је тај документ био један од пратећих елемената Душановог Законика или пак засебно писано штиво, но како год да било, тај запис представља први икада забележени и то тако прецизан запис о једној раси паса и можемо га назвати Првим писаним стандардом за псе на целој земаљској кугли.

https://www.facebook.com/notes/red-crvenog-zmaja/%D0%B7%D0%B0%D0%BA%D0%BE%D0%BD%D0%B8%D0%BA-%D1%80%D0%B0%D1%81e-%D0%BF%D0%B0%D1%81-%D1%81%D0%B8%D0%BB%D0%B2%D0%B0%D0%BD-%D0%B7%D0%BC%D0%B0%D1%98/514051761954510

Takodje CuRi je vuciji kralj. Ovo je veoma vazno jer je u rimskoj kraljevini koja je originalno bila konfederacija tri plemena (tre bhew), svako pleme imalo kralja. Ova tri kralja su formairala Curiu, odnosno sabor. CuRia sabor vucijih kraljeva...Zvanicna etimologija kaze da rec potice od staro latinske reci "coviria" (couria jer je v bilo u) sto znaci sabor. Ali da li je cuiria ustvari dosla od CuRija sto je bio originalni vuciji sabor?

The word curia is thought to derive from Old Latin coviria, meaning "a gathering of men" (co-, "together" =vir, "man").[1] In this sense, any assembly, public or private, could be called a curia. In addition to the Roman curiae, voting assemblies known as curiae existed in other towns of Latium, and similar institutions existed in other parts of Italy. During the republic, local curiae were established in Italian and provincial municipia and coloniae. In imperial times, local magistrates were often elected by municipal senates, which also came to be known as curiae. By extension, the word curia came to mean not just a gathering, but also the place where an assembly would gather, such as a meeting house.[2]

The most important curiae at Rome were the thirty that together made up the comitia curiata. Traditionally ascribed to the kings, each of the three tribes established by Romulus, the Ramnes, Tities, and Luceres, was divided into ten curiae. In theory, each gens (family, clan) belonged to a particular curia, although whether this was strictly observed throughout Roman history is uncertain.[2][3]

Dakle svako vucije pleme je imalo vucijijeg kralja CuRi i vuciji sabor, CuRiju. Velika rimska CuRija (izgovara se Kurija) je bio sabor vucijih kraljeva, sabor vucijeg roda.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Curia

takodje rimska kurija, sabor vucijeg pastira, vucijeg kralja, pape, dis patera, lup patera, vucijeg oca vucije (rimske) crkve...

The Roman Curia is the administrative apparatus of the Holy See and the central governing body of the entire Catholic Church, together with the Pope.[1]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roman_Curia

Interesantno. Irci - Sabini - Srbi - Vuciji narod. Kakva je veza?

Sveti Sava = Vuciji Pastir
Nemanjici = Vuciji kraljevi = Sveti ratnici konjanici i kopljanici, vukovi a ne ovce, Srbi ili Sloveni ili i jedno i drugo?

Ko su Srbi, ko je vuciji narod? Ko su Volsci, Volci deca boga Daboga hromog dabe?

dublin · 25.03.2013. u 13:26

ja sam stvarno upao u zemlju cuda. gore sam naveo primer koriscenja sufiksa -sa

Bíuu-sa oc irbáig dar far cenn-si fri Maccidóndu.
"I (emph.) am boasting about you to the Macedonians."

Na najstarijem, oghamskom irskom Macci (koje je kasnije postalo Mac) znaci sin.

Sample texts in Ogham
Texts in Primitive Irish

Transliteration
LIE LUGNAEDON MACCI MENUEH

Translation
The stone of Lugnaedon son of Limenueh

http://www.omniglot.com/writing/ogham.htm

Sta onda znaci "Maccidóndu", Makidon? Makidun? Sinovi Dona? Sinovi Dane? Sinovi tvrdjave? Sinovi boga Daboga?

makedon - makedom - majkedom - majke dom - domovina
МА – како основа од МАКЕ означува - жена, мајка во сите индоевропски јазици.
ДОН – ДИОН(А) означува - Бог, божество, божица.

gde sve ovo vodi?

VelikiMedur · 26.03.2013. u 12:41

u ludnicu...

- - - - - - - - - -

....

dublin · 26.03.2013. u 14:28

mi smo svi vec u ludinici. al izgleda da sam ja nasao prozor koji nije zakljucan... videcemo gde vodi. za sad je zabavno...

dublin · 28.03.2013. u 18:51

Leto (Leda) - Leto je bila boginja Poljaka, član trojstva Leda, Lada i Eži. Kao što i samo ime ove boginje kaže , ona je bila vladarka leta i zrelog žitnog klasja.

Лада — богиња лета, љубави и лепоте из старословенске митологије. По веровању старих Словена она живи у другом свету званом Ириј до пролећа, када се буди носећи са собом пролеће.

Познат је и обред ладарице који се у Србији врши под именом краљице. Основне одлике овог ритуала описао је Вук Караџић:
На дан Свете Тројице окупи се група од десетак младих девојака од којих је једна обучена као краљица, друга као краљ, а трећа као барјактар. Краљица седне на столицу док око ње игра коло преосталих девојака, а краљ и барјактар играју сами за себе. На овај начин краљице иду од куће до куће тражећи девојке за удају. Још једна одлика ритуала који се врше у част Ладе јесте прескакање ватре. (da li je ovo ostatak hodanja po vatri, nestinarstva???)

The word 'Lado' does indeed appear in many Slavic and Baltic wedding and folk songs, particularly those sung during Ivan Kupala and other summer festivals. Its meaning, if indeed it has any, is unclear;

The same can be said for the following Serbian Lado-song recorded in Nikola Begović's Srpske narodne pjesme iz Like i Banije, which was likewise sung by young girls standing in circles.
Lado! Vid slept in a meadow
Lado is beautiful!
Lado! fair elf-maids were waking him
Lado is beautiful!
Lado! Stand up young Vid!
Lado is beautiful!
Lado! your house is on sale;
Lado is beautiful!
Lado! your mother is dying;
Lado is beautiful!
Lado! your lover serves another.
Lado is beautiful!
Lado! Then answers young Vid
Lado is beautiful!
Lado! you are lying fair elf-maids;
Lado is beautiful!
Lado! neither is my mother dying;
Lado is beautiful!
Lado! neither is my house on sale;
Lado is beautiful!
Lado! but my lover serves another.
Lado is beautiful!
Here Lado does not appear to be the name of any deity, but is merely an exclamation. However, the main character of this song does not bear the name Ivan, but rather Vid, in which one can easily recognise the name of Svetovid, a major Slavic god of war, prophecies and harvest.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lada_(goddess)

Lada se u ovoj pesmi iz "Like" vezuje za Vida, Svetovida slovenskog vrhovnog boga...Ne zna se sta znaci njeno ime...

Česi i danas Ladu zovu Pana - gospođa.

http://nebeskiprsten9.blogspot.ie/2012/05/boginja-lada.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Svetovid

In Greek mythology, Leto (Greek: Λητώ, Lētṓ; Λατώ, Lātṓ in Dorian Greek, etymology and meaning disputed) is a daughter of the Titans Coeus and Phoebe and the sister of Asteria.[1]
In the Olympian scheme, Zeus is the father of her twins,[3] Apollo and Artemis, the Letoides, which Leto conceived after her hidden beauty accidentally caught the eyes of Zeus.
This is her one active mythic role: once Apollo and Artemis are grown, Leto withdraws, to remain a dim[5] and benevolent matronly figure upon Olympus, her part already played. In Roman mythology, Leto's equivalent is Latona, a Latinization of her name, influenced by Etruscan Letun.
Leto was identified from the fourth century onwards with the principal local mother goddess of Anatolian Lycia. Her name is most likely to have a Lycian origin, as her earliest cult was centered there. Leto may have the same Lycian origin as "Leda", meaning "woman/wife" in the Lycian language.

U grckoj mitologiji Leto je cerka titana Coeus i Phoebe. Ona je zatrudnela sa vrhovnim bogom Zevsom (Vucijim bogom ocem) i rodila mu je blizance sina Apola (Vucijeg boga sina) i Cerku Artemis koja se cesto podrazumeva ko jedna od emanacija boginje Leto. U Rimu je poznata kao Letona a u Etruriji kao Letun. Leto je identifikovana ko majka boginja Lycie (Vucije zemlje, koja mnogo podseca na nasu rec Lika za koju se ne zna odakle potice). Ime boginje najverovatnije ima Lycijsko poreklo. Leto verovatno ima isti koren kao i Leda sto na likijskom znaci zena...

Antoninus Liberalis is not alone in hinting that Leto came down from the land of the Hyperboreans in the guise of a she-wolf, or that she sought out the "wolf-country" of Lycia, formerly called Tremilis, which she renamed to honour wolves that had befriended her[19] for her denning. Another late source, Aelian, also links Leto with wolves and Hyperboreans:
Wolves are not easily delivered of their young, only after twelve days and twelve nights, for the people of Delos maintain that this was the length of time that it took Leto to travel from the Hyperboreoi to Delos."[20]
Most accounts agree that she found the barren floating island of Delos, still bearing its archaic name of Asterios, which was neither mainland nor a real island, and gave birth there, promising the island wealth from the worshippers who would flock to the obscure birthplace of the splendid god who was to come. The island was surrounded by swans. As a gesture of gratitude, Delos was secured with four pillars and later became sacred to Apollo.
It is remarkable that Leto brought forth Artemis, the elder twin, without travail, as Callimachus wrote,[21] as if she were merely revealing another manifestation of herself. By contrast, Leto labored for nine nights and nine days for Apollo, according to the Homeric Hymn to Delian Apollo, in the presence of all the first among the deathless goddesses as witnesses: Dione, Rhea, Ichnaea, Themis and the "loud-moaning" sea-goddess Amphitrite. Only Hera kept apart, perhaps to kidnap Eileithyia or Ilithyia, the goddess of childbirth, to prevent Leto from going into labor. Instead Artemis, having been born first, assisted with the birth of Apollo. Another version, in the Homeric Hymn to Delian Apollo and in an Orphic hymn, states that Artemis was born before Apollo, on the island of Ortygia, and that she helped Leto cross the sea to Delos the next day to give birth there to Apollo.

Leto je dosla iz hiperboreje (sa teritorije iznad epira, iz srbije, severnog balkana, dunavske ravnice) u obliku vucice trazeci vuciju zemlju Lyciu gde ce riditi Apola na isti nacin na koji vucice radjaju vucice, dugo, tesko i bolno, devet dana i devet noci.

Interesantno je da Zevs zvuci kao zevati, razjapiti celjusti a apolo zvuci kao apiti ugristi....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leto

Svetovid, Zevs, Leda Leto..???

Lesandar · 28.03.2013. u 21:27

dublin:
Svetovid, Zevs, Leda Leto..???

I lauta, lutnja, kao letnji instrument

LeoneMontana · 28.03.2013. u 22:33

Вулфила (на готском значи вучић, мали вук; 310—388; латинизовано Улфила) био је готски аријански епископ, мисионар и преводилац библије, који је провео одређено време у Римском царству.

Сребрни кодекс из 6. века, фрагмент Улфилиног превода Библије.
Улфила се замонашио и Евсевије Никомедијски га је посветио за епископа, након чега се Улфила вратио међу Готе да ради као мисионар и проповеда хришћанство.
Превео је Библију са грчког на готски. Готи нису имали писмо осим руна које су коришћене у паганским обредима, тако да је Улфила адаптацијом грчког алфабета, уз коришћење латинских слова и руна, осмислио готско писмо. Делови овог превода сачувани су фрагментарно и познати под именом Сребрни кодекс који је у 6. веку настао у остроготској Италији. Данас се овај рукопис налази у Универзитетској библиотеци у Упсали, у Шведској.

Ulfilas, or Gothic Wulfila: little wolf or belonging to Wolf (also Ulphilas. Orphila)[1] (ca. 310 – 383)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ulfilas
http://sr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Улфила

Nije toponim, ali zanimljivi su mi ovu goti... rasprava je da li germanskog ili slovenskog porekla!

dublin · 29.03.2013. u 22:37

Hvala sto pratite ovu temu i hvala na komentarima.

Vuciji sveci se nalaze po celoj evropi. Neko je morao da zameni hromog dabu.

Apulu, Danas Puglia u juznoj italiji je grad koji su u davnoj proslosti osnovali ilirski Apuli. Teritorija Apulije se nalazila izmedju Samiuma (Sabina) i Lucanie (Lucina) dva vucija naroda. Bili su cuveni po vuni i kaze se da je zemlja mozda dobila ime po starom ilisrkom kralju Apulu a mozda i po etrurskom bogu Apulu (Apolonu) a mozda i po samim Apulima.

Apulu, now Puglia a county of Magna Grecia in the south of Italy. If this portion of country received its name, as historians believe,
from the Apuli who early established themselves there, it very soon extended itself, with the name of Apolia, beyond the little territory occupied by
that obscure people. In the time of Augustus, it comprehended all the region that lay between Samnium and Lucania on the west, and the
Adriatic on the east, having for its northern boundary the Tifemus, and terminating on the south in the Iapygian promontory, on either
side of which was the Adriatic or the Tarentine gulf. It was famous for its wools, superior to all the produce of Italy. Some suppose that
it is called after Apulus, an ancient king of the country before the Trojan war. Plin. 3, c. 1 1 .

http://books.google.ie/books?id=A0Y...AEwAQ#v=onepage&q=apulia apulu apollo&f=false

Kad su se iliri doselili u apuliu osnovali su grad Luceriu (Vuciji grad), amozda znaci i sveta suma (Lug)

When the Illyrians migrated to Italy and founded Luceria in Apulia

Lucera is an ancient city founded in Daunia, the centre of Dauni territory (in present day Apulia). Archeological excavations show the presence of a bronze age village inside the city boundaries. Lucera was probably named after either Lucius, a mythical Dauno king, or a temple dedicated to the goddess Lux Cereris. A third possibility is that the city was founded and named by the Etruscans, in which case the name probably means Holy Wood (luc = wood, eri = holy).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Luceria#History

http://www.historyfiles.co.uk/KingListsEurope/ItalyDauni.htm

Izgleda da ovi narodi imaju veze sa I haplogrupom...

it seems that the I* HG marker (pre-roman )was the marker that the Illyrians took to Italy in the charts attached, the adriatic coast named people are - udine, piceni, sanniti, grecani salento, lucera and messapi. The Illyrian-ligurian wars did happen in the bronzeage........I wonder if the sardinians got some of these markers.

http://www.plosone.org/article/info:doi/10.1371/journal.pone.0050794

Apolo iz Weiia (Aplu) koga je izradio vajar Vulca...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apollo_of_Veii

Apuli su Tracko pleme koje je zivelo oko grada Apulon u transilvaniji. Istoricari smatraju da postoji veza izmedju ova dva naroda i ova dva grada. Verovatno jer su i ovaj deo italije i dacia vucije zemlje.

The Apuli were a Thracian tribe centered at the Dacian town Apulon (Lat. Apulum) near what is now Alba Iulia in Transylvania, Romania.
Apuli has clear resemblance to Apulia, the ancient southeastern Italy region, which it is believe to have been settled by Illyrian tribes (also named Apuli or Iapyges).
Linguists use it as an example for the similarities between Illyrian and Daco-Thracian languages.[1]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apuli

Dacka tvrdjava na vrhu Piatra Craivii je po mnogim arheolozima stari Apulon cuveni dacki grad plemena Apuli.

Apulon (Apoulon, Apula) was a Dacian fortress city close to modern Alba Iulia, Romania from where the Latin name of Apulum is derived. The exact location is believed by many archaeologists to be the Dacian fortifications on top of Piatra Craivii, Craiva, Cricău, about 20 km north of Alba-Iulia.[1]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Apulon

Apulon je kasnije preimenovan od rimljana u Alba Iulia. U reanom srednjem veku ovaj grad je bio poznat kao belgrade, beograd.

During the Roman period the settlement was called Apulum.[4] The second part "Iulia" refers to "Julius" (in Hungarian Gyula), the deputy leader of Transylvania.[5] Its Hungarian name Gyulafehérvár literally means "white castle of the Gyula"[6] or "white city of Julius"[5] and it is a translation of the Slavic "Belgrade" ("white castle").[5] The old Romanian name of the town was Bălgrad originated from Slavic too.
In 955 it was called Gyula dux Civitatem Albam in Ereel.[7] Later in the Middle Ages different names occurred as Frank episcopus Belleggradienesis in 1071, in 1134 Albae Civitatis, in 1153 Belegrada, in 1177 Albensis Ultrasilvanus, in 1199 eccl. Micahelis, in 1200 Albe Transilvane, in 1201 Albe Transsilvane, in 1206 castrum Albens, in 1213 canonicis Albensibus, in 1219 Albensis eccl. Transsylvane, in 1231 B. Michaelis arch. Transsilv., in 1242 Alba... Civitas, in 1245 Alba sedes eptus, in 1291 Alba Jula, in 1572 Feyrvar, in 1574 Feyérvár, in 1576 Weissenburg, in 1579 Belugrad, in 1619 Gyula Feyervár, in 1690 Gyula Fehérvár, in 1715 Karlsburg.[7]
Beside the name Karlsburg another German name Weyssenburg was also used.[4] In Yiddish and Hebrew Karlsburg was prevalent, in Ladino sources Carlosburg.[4] Alba Carolina was also a medieval Latin form of its name.[4]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alba_Iulia

Tartarija tablice su nadjene na 30 kilometara od albe iulije ili ti beograda.

he Tărtăria tablets are three tablets, discovered in 1961 by archaeologist Nicolae Vlassa at a Neolithic site in the village of Tărtăria (about 30 km (19 mi) from Alba Iulia)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tărtăria_tablets

Na irskom tar teóra (izgovara se tartora, tartara) znaci preko granice

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/teorainn

U tartariju su prognani stari bogovi kada je zevs dosao na vlast

Tartarus was used as a prison for the worst of villains, including Cronus and the other Titans who were thrown in by Zeus

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tartarus

Tartara Tartarus Tartarija mesto gde su nadjene vincanske religijske tablice...

vučko · 29.03.2013. u 22:55

Moguče je, da ime Apulija ima veze sa imenom Pula (grad u Istri). Zar nisu Grci stavljali ponekad slovo A ispred nekog imena.

Апулија (итал. Puglia, транскрибовано: Пуља, лат. Apulia) (http://sr.wikipedia.org/sr/Апулија)

dublin · 03.04.2013. u 13:25

Izvinjavam se zbog ne prevodjenja, nemam vremena. Ukratko postoji najverovatnije direktna veza izmedju iraca, srba, ilira i vucijeg naroda preko srpske reci Iara (jara, strasna bela toplota, srdzba) i irske reci Iarn (gvozdje). Ilirii = Il + iaran = ljudi gvozdja. proto indo evropska rec *h₁ésh₂r̥ krv, crven, i hisar ime brda i ilirske tvrdjave kod leskovca gde je nadjena najstarija topionica gvozdja u evropi. Bog Jarilo bog rata i vrucine, koji je otet od peruna i odveden u iriju, zemlju mrtvih kojom vlada veles, koja je zelena zemlja stocara preko mora...Jarilo je nadjen kod baltickih vucijih slovena Volaca....

Ne zaboravite da se kaze da su vuciji narodi u italiji dosli iz ilirije.

According to eDIL, the pronunciation was "Orig. ïarn, later íarn, monosyllabic, and íarann". It's pretty clearly from Proto-Celtic *īsarnom with expected loss of medial *s. The ultimate etymology is unknown, although a relationship with PIE *h₁ésh₂r̥ "blood" has been proposed. The Germanic languages may have borrowed the word from Celtic or they may have both borrowed (or inherited) it from a common source.

It is interesting how "god works in misterious ways". The earliest iron methalurgical center in the world, dated to 14th–13th century bce, was found in south eastern Serbia in the hillfort settlement on the hill called Hisar. This site belongs to the earliest proto illyrian period.

Here is an archeological report about the Hisar (Iron) hill finds:

http://scindeks-clanci.ceon.rs/data/pdf/0354-6306/2006/0354-63060603105S.pdf
http://www.nsseme.com/about/inc/casopisi/RP48/34 Medovic.pdf

Serbia has increadible number of "gaelic" toponimes and hydronimes. Serbian language has huge amount of "gaelic" words and believe or not "gaelic" has huge amounts of serbian words. The oldest mythology of serbia and Ireland, that of the Crom dubh is completely intertwined to the point that i now believe that originally both peoples were one and the same and that one of the waves of irish people originally came from the balkans.

I also believe that original etnonim irish comes from iron as in people with iron or people from iron land.

íarn - iron
iarannach - iron people

Probable origin is from old serbian word "jara". This word is pronounced "iara" and used to be written like that before language was reformed in the 19th century. This word means white heat, intense heat often from an oven or furnace, fury, vehemence, intensity, ferocity...

In serbian it is used to describe the heat (and light) of the sun: jarko sunce. It is also an archaic synonime for spring: Jara.

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/jara#Serbo-Croatian

In slavic mythology there is even a god Jarilo, Jarovit (pronounced Iarilo, Iarovit) who was a major male Proto-Slavic deity of vegetation, fertility and spring, also associated with war and harvest.

The only historic source that mentions this deity is a 12th century biography of proselytizing German bishop Otto of Bamberg, who, during his expeditions to convert the pagan tribes of Wendish and Polabian Slavs, encountered festivals in honor of the war-god Gerovit in cities of Wolgast and Havelberg. Gerovit is most likely a German corruption of original Slavic name Jarovit.

Pogledajte gde je nadjen jarilo u gradovima volaca, vucijih slovena...

All of these spring festivals were basically alike: Processions of villagers would go around for a walk in the country or through villages on this day. Something or someone was identified to be Jarilo or Juraj: A doll made of straw, a man or a child adorned with green branches, or a girl dressed like a man, riding on a horse. Certain songs were sung which alluded to Juraj/Jarilo's return from a distant land across the sea, the return of spring into the world, blessings, fertility and abundance to come.

Jarilo was a son of the supreme Slavic god of thunder, Perun, his lost, missing, tenth son, born on the last night of February, the festival of Velja Noć (Great Night), the pagan Slavic celebration of the New Year. On the same night, however, Jarilo was stolen from his father and taken to the world of the dead, where he was adopted and raised by Veles, Perun's enemy, Slavic god of the underworld and cattle. The Slavs believed the underworld to be an ever-green world of eternal spring and wet, grassy plains, where Jarilo grew up guarding the cattle of his stepfather. In the mythical geography of ancient Slavs, the land of the dead was assumed to lie across the sea, where migrating birds would fly every winter.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jarilo

Ancient Slavs viewed their world as a huge tree, with the treetop and branches representing the heavenly abode of gods and the world of mortals, whilst the roots represented the underworld. And while Perun, seen as a hawk or eagle sitting on a tallest branch of tree, was believed to be ruler of heaven and living world, Veles, seen as a huge serpent coiling around the roots, was ruling the world of dead. This was actually quite a lovely place, described in folk tales as a green and wet world of grassy plains and eternal spring, where various fantastic creatures dwell and the spirits of deceased watch over Veles' herds of cattle. In more geographical terms, the world of Veles was located, the Slavs believed, "across the sea", and it was there the migrating birds would fly to every winter. In folk tales this land is called Virey or Iriy. Each year, the god of fertility and vegetation, Jarilo, who also dwelt there during winter, would return from across the sea and bring spring into the world of the living.
Veles also regularly sent spirits of the dead into the living world as his heralds. Festivals in honour of him were held near the end of the year, in winter, when time was coming to the very end of world order, chaos was growing stronger, the borders between worlds of living and dead were fading, and ancestral spirits would return amongst the living. This was the ancient pagan celebration of Velja noc (Great Night), the relic of which still persists amongst many Slavic countries in folk customs of Koleda, a kind of combination of carnival and Halloween, which can happen anywhere from Christmas up to end of February. Young men, known as koledari or vucari would dress long coats of sheep's wool and don grotesque masks, roaming around villages in groups and raising a lot of noise. They sang songs saying they travelled a long way, and they are all wet and muddy, an allusion of the wet underworld of Veles from which they came as ghosts of dead. The master of any house they visited would welcome them warmly and presented them with gifts. This is an example of Slavic shamanism, which also indicates Veles was a god of magic and wealth. The gifts given to koledari were probably believed to be passed onto him (which makes him very much like a dragon hoarding treasure), thus ensuring good fortune and wealth for the house and family through entire year. As seen in descriptions from the Primary Chronicle, by angering Veles one would be stricken by diseases.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Veles_(god)

The term rai in Slavic languages is a term for a heavenly or earthly paradise.

The etymology of Common Slavic rai is disputed. It is now generally regarded as a direct borrowing from Iranian ray, "heavenly radiance, beatitude". Another root is Proto-Slavic yrii, "land of warmth."

The term rai is generally applied to the Garden of Eden. In several Slavic languages, including Russian, the nearness of rai to raj meaning "region", "district,"...

yrii - land of wormth, garden of eden comes from the same root as iron, heat, white heat, radiance...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rai_(paradise)

PIE root *pelh1u-[6] "many", Celtic elu-, which is seen in Welsh elw, meaning "gain" or "profit", and the Old Irish prefix il-, meaning "many" or "multiple".[3]

il + íarn = iliarn = ilirian = illyrian = many irons = iron armed warriors????

At the moment the origin of the name is not known, the language is not known. But Illyrians are somehow connected with the iron and the above Hisar site is one of the Illyrian sites which later became thrakian and eventually tribalian.

The historical beginning of the peoples we later know as Illyrians is placed at approximately 1000 BC.[15] The origin of the Illyrians remains a problem for modern prehistorians. The consensus of the primordialists[16] is that the ethno-linguistic ancestors of the Illyrians, labelled Proto-Illyrians, branched off from the main linguistic Proto-Indo-European trunk before the Iron Age. Current theories of Illyrian origin are based on ancient remnants of material culture found in the area, but archaeological remains alone have so far proven insufficient for a definite answer to the question of the Illyrian ethnogenesis.[17]
When the Proto-Illyrians became a distinct group remains unclear. They emerge out of the wider Paleo-Balkans group by the Iron Age, although, since the language is not known in any detail, it is uncertain which populations should be classed as "Illyrian" on ethno-linguistic grounds, and many tribes formerly classed as Illyrian are now considered Venetic.[18]

Maybe we have found the illyrian language?

Have a look at the first picture on the wiki page. It is a Hallstatt culture depiction of Illyrian warriors. They are armed with spears and celts, traditional celtic and later irish axes...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illyrians

dublin · 03.04.2013. u 14:12

Iliri su zrtvovali decu. Iliri su se zakopavali u tumulusima. U irskoj Crom Dubh, Hromi Daba je takodje poznat i kao kralj tumulusa ili snop...U velesovoj knjizi se na nekoliko mesta pominje nas did, dub, snop, kao i postovanje duba snopa kao boga...

http://forum.krstarica.com/showthre...-i-slovena?p=24539818&viewfull=1#post24539818

Crom Cruach or Cromm Crúaich (Classical Irish/Gaelic pronunciation /ˈkɾˠɔmˠ ˈkɾˠuəç/), also known as Cenn Cruach /ˈkʲɛnˠ: ˈkɾˠuəxˠ/ or Cenncroithi /ˈkʲɛnˠ: ˈkɾˠoθʲɨ/, was a deity in pre-Christian Ireland, reputedly propitiated with human sacrifice, whose worship is said to have been ended by St. Patrick.

Crom Cruach's name takes several forms and can be interpreted in several ways. Crom (or cromm) means "bent, crooked, stooped". Cenn means "head". Cruach can be an adjective, "bloody, gory", or a noun, meaning variously "slaughter", "stack of corn", or "pile, heap, mound". Plausible meanings include "bloody crooked one", "crooked stack of corn", "crooked one of the mound", "bloody head", "head of the stack of corn" or "head of the mound".[7] It has also been interpreted as deriving from Proto-Celtic *Croucacrumbas "crooked one of the tumulus".[citation needed]

The references in the dinsenchas to sacrifice in exchange for milk and grain suggest that Crom was a fertility deity. The description of his image as a gold figure surrounded by twelve stone or bronze figures has been interpreted by some as representing the sun surrounded by the signs of the zodiac, making Crom a solar deity.[8]
He is related to the later mythological and folkloric figure Crom Dubh. The festival for Crom Cruach is called Domhnach Crom Dubh, Crom Dubh Sunday.[8]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crom_Cruach

Crom Dubh or Crum Dubh (Irish pronunciation: [krˠoumˠ d̪ˠuβˠ], Scottish Gaelic: [kʰɾɔum t̪uh]), meaning "black crooked [one]", alt. "Dark Crom", was a Celtic god, for which see The Voyage of Bran, Book II.[1] He may have been represented by megaliths.

Human sacrifice also played a role in the lives of the Illyrians.[38] Arrian records the chieftain Cleitus the Illyrian as sacrificing three boys, three girls and three rams just before his battle with Alexander the Great. The most common type of burial among the Iron Age Illyrians was tumulus or mound burial. The kin of the first tumuli was buried around that, and the higher the status of those in these burials the higher the mound. Archaeology has found many artifacts placed within these tumuli such as weapons, ornaments, garments and clay vessels. Illyrians believed these items were necessary for a dead person's journey into the afterlife.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Illyrians

dublin · 03.04.2013. u 18:44

Jarovit, Jarevid, Žerovid (Gerovit), Ruđevid (Rujevit), Porevid i Jarilo su sve imena srpskog i zapadno slovenskog boga rata, koji ima iste atribute kao i Mars i Ares. Sad kad znamo da Jarovit ima veze sa Iara sto znaci gvozdje, ne cudi sto je ime srpskog boga rata Iarovit odnosno Gvozdeni ali i Planmeni, I besni, razjareni...Isto kao i Ares. Usput da li vas Ares asocira na iare, iara...? Ali kao i Mars, Jarilo (ili kako se nekada pisalo Iarilo) je i bog poljoprivrede. Njega prate gavranovi isto kao i Irskog boga ratnika Brana...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bran_the_Blessed

To je isti onaj Bran (gavran) koji je poharao delfe....

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallic_invasion_of_the_Balkans

Jarovid je bog srdžbe, jarosti i rata. Poznat je i kao Jarevid ili Jarovit. U osnovi samog njegovog imena je reč jar, koja označava vatru, žestinu i gnev. Iako su skoro svi slovenski bogovi istovremeno i ratnici, samo je Jarovid zapravo bog rata, onaj koji upravlja njegovim tokom. Poznat je i pod imenima Žerovid (Gerovit), Ruđevid (Rujevit), zatim Porevid i Jarilo. Prema legendi, Jarovid dolazi u pratnji vrana pa možda otud veoma čest motiv u srpskim epskim pesmama da ratne vesti donose crne ptice koje govore: „Dolećeše dva vrana gavrana“. Opasan je sa sedam mačeva, dok je osmi mač, koji drži u ruci, nepobedivi mač Jarost (gnev), a oko čela mu je svezana traka smrti.

Gerovit se može shvatiti na dva načina: kao bog rata i kao božanstvo Sunca koje, kao Jarilo, označava donosioca plodnosti. Ispitaćemo prvo Gerovitovu ratničku prirodu. Na ostrvu Rujan nalazio se hram u kome je najvažnije mesto zauzimala Gerovitova statua sa sedam glava i osam mačeva. Hram je bio sagrađen od drveta i sastojao se od jedne prostorije u kojoj su se nalazila četri stuba, dok je na zidovima visila ljubičasta draperija. Šta je simbolizovalo sedam glava Gerovita, odnosno, Ruđevita, kako su ga zvali na ostrvu Rujan? Neki smatraju da je u ovom božanstvu sadržano svih sedam bogova kijevskog panteona dok je prema drugima sedam glava simbol sedam letnjih meseci kojima je Gerovit vladao. Ista stvar stoji i sa sedam mačeva, dok je osmi mač koji Gerovit drži u ruci njegov sopstveni i predstavlja tako atribut jednog ratničkog božanstva.Tu je i štit prekriven zlatnim pločicama koji je kao sveti predmet čuvan u hramu predstavljajući samog Gerovita. Ovaj štit nošen je među narod koji se sa poštovanjem klanjao manifestacji svog božanstva.
Što se tiče planetarne korespondencije, Aleksandar Asov povezuje Jarila sa ratničkom planetom Mars. Mnoge činjenice govore tome u prilog: Jarilova boja je crvena, dok je on sam povezan sa zodijačkim poljem Ovna. Mesec belojar, koji u sebi sadrži Jarilovo ime, počinjao je 21. marta, odnosno onog datuma kada Sunce ulazi u zodijačko polje Ovna. Jare je takođe zadržano u imenu ovog meseca, a upravo je jagnje, kao mladunče ovna, u stara vremena bilo žrtvovano Gerovitu u čast. Takođe imamo imenicu jarost i povratni glagol razjariti se koji u sebi sadrže Jarilovo ime i tako na savršen način opisuju njegovu ratničku prirodu. Dolaskom hrišćanstva sveti Đorđe preuzima funkcije Gerovita. Sveti Georgije je svetac-ratnik koji se bori protiv sila mraka oličenih u liku aždaje. Smatra se da ova aždaja označava paganska božanstva i sile koje je hrišćanstvo proglasilo demonima i upravo ove „demone“ ubija sveti Đorđe ubistvom „aždahе“. No ako uzmemo u obzir da je sveti Đorđe niko drugi do Gerovit, ovakvo objašnjenje postaje neodgovarajuće, skrivajući pri tom mnogo jasniju mitsku sliku. Jer, ako otklonimo granice koje je postavila jedna vera, u ovom slučaju hrišćanstvo, dobijamo sliku jednog svetlog, pravednog boga, boga koji se pokorava zakonu Prava, koji uništava sile koje stoje na putu Svetlosti, tj. sile koje uzrokuju degeneraciju i propast svega što je dobro, lepo i pravedno. Upravo je planetarna sfera Marsa vezana za ovakvo božansko čišćenje i uništavanje onog što treba biti uništeno. Još jedna činjenica ide u prilog teoriji Asova o povezanosti Jarila sa planetom Mars. Grčki Ares, odnosno, rimski Mars ljubavnik je boginje Afrodite, kojoj odgovara slovenska Lada, a kao što znamo, Gerovit i Lada predstavljeni su u slovenskoj mitologiji kao božanski par. Ova veza može se shvatiti na dva načina: kao međusobno prožimanje Ljubavi i Mržnje, ili odnos Ljubavi i Rata, koji može postati drugo lice Ljubavi i obrnuto. No, može se shvatiti i drugačije: kao odnos i povezanost dva božasntva plodnosti. Zbog toga prelazimo na analizu drugog aspekta Gerovita tj. proučavanje Gerovita kao božanstva plodnosti.
Spomenuli smo već da se Gerovitovih sedam glava može odnositi na sedam letnjih meseci kojima on vlada. Njemu nasuprot stoji Porevit, koji vlada nad preostalih pet zimskih meseci, a koji je istovremeno Gerovitov brat, čiji se hram takođe nalazio na ostrvu Rujan. Shvaćen kao božanstvo plodnosti, Gerovit predstavlja samo Sunce koje omogućuje da žito dobro rodi, dok kao bog-zaštitnik on štiti useve od razornog gràda. Rituali vezani za Gerovita slave ga upravo kao božanstvo plodnosti. Njegovi praznici bili su u rano leto, a slaveći njega, Sloveni su slavili ponovo buđenje Sunca posle zimskog perioda. Jedan slovenski ritual veoma nalikuje na ritual koji su Kelti vršili u čast svog božasntva plodnosti – Rogatog boga. U doba Jarilovoh praznika momci su pravili lutka od slame i zelenog granja, koja je predstvaljala Gerovita. Ovu lutku Sloveni su bacali u vodu nadajući se da će to omogućiti rodnu godinu. Kelti su, kao što znamo, spaljivali lutke od pruća iz istih razloga, dok se njihov Rogati bog predstavljao kao zeleno božanstvo obraslo u lišće.

dublin · 04.04.2013. u 17:41

Samo par kratkih napomena:

Jarovid je bog srdžbe, jarosti i rata.

Ares (Greek: Ἄρης [árɛːs], Μodern Greek: Άρης [ˈaris]) was the Greek god of war. He is one of the Twelve Olympians, and the son of Zeus and Hera.[1] In Greek literature, he often represents the physical or violent aspect of war, in contrast to the armored Athena, whose functions as a goddess of intelligence include military strategy and generalship.[2]
The Greeks were ambivalent toward Ares: although he embodied the physical valor necessary for success in war, he was a

dangerous force, "overwhelming, insatiable in battle, destructive, and man-slaughtering

Kliknite za proširenje...

."[3] Fear (Phobos) and Terror (Deimos) were yoked to his battle chariot.[4]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ares

ARES was the great Olympian god of war, battlelust, violence, rage and manliness.

http://www.theoi.com/Olympios/AresGod.html

Dakle Jarilo (Jara, Jare) i Ares imaju iste atribute. Aresa su grci mrzeli i cak i Zevs kaze da ga od svih bogova najmanje voli. Ares je bio na strani trojanaca...

In the Iliad, his father Zeus tells him that he is the god most hateful to him.[5] An association with Ares endows places and objects with a savage, dangerous, or militarized quality.[6] His value as a war god is placed in doubt: during the Trojan War, Ares was on the losing side, while Athena, often depicted in Greek art as holding Nike (Victory) in her hand, favored the triumphant Greeks.[7]

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ares

Jos jedna stvar je interesnatna. Jarilovo ime Gerovit, Herovit mene strasno podseca na Geroj, Heroj, Herakle...

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Heracles

dublin · 08.04.2013. u 18:25

i evo Gerovita i Herakla zajedno, kako se u grckom mitu bore jedan protiv drugog.

GERYON (or Geryones) was a three-bodied (three-headed), four-winged giant who dwelt on the red island of Erytheia in the westernmost reaches of the earth-encircling River Ocean.

He possessed a fabulous herd of cattle whose coats were tinged red by the light of sunset. Herakles was sent to fetch these by Eurystheus as one of his twelve labours.

The hero reached the island by sailing across the Ocean in a golden cup-boat borrowed from the sun-god Helios. There he encountered and slew the cattle-herder Eurytion, the two-headed guard dog Orthros, and finally three-bodied Geryon himself. With this task complete the hero herded the cattle into his boat and led them back to the Greek Peloponnese.

Geryon may originally have been associated with the Constellation Orion, his two-headed dog Orthos with the adjacent canines Canis Major and Minor, and his cattle with Taurus the bull. His father's name Khrysaor ("Golden Sword") was often applied to the Orion constellation.

Geryon (Γηρυων - nema adekvatne etimologije) je bio troglavi (nekada i trotelni) dzin sa severozapada koji je ziveo na prostranim livadama iza okeanusa potamusa (okeana reke, dunava) u zemlji Erytheia (crvena ridja) i tamo je imao ogromna stada prelepih goveda. Ova stada je cuvao takodje dzin Eurytion i dvoglavi pas Orthros. Kralj Argosa, Eurystheus, je poslao Herakla da ukrade ova goveda od Geriona. Ovaj Eurystheus je interesantan jer je simbol Argosa vuk. Ovo je jako interesantno prica jer dovodi u sukob stare bogove (triglava, jarovita) i nove (olimpijske bogove, zevsa vucijeg boga i njegovog heroja Herakla).

http://www.wildwinds.com/coins/greece/argolis/argos/i.html

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Argos

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eurystheus

dublin · 10.04.2013. u 12:49

Drako, steg zmaja ognjenog vuka

Cetiri plemena su bila deo Samnitske konfederacije: Hirpini, Caudini, Caraceni, and Pentri. Heraclides Ponticus kaze da je samnitsko pleme Lucani dobilo ime po tome sto su postovali vukove i sto su nosili vuka ispred sebe za vreme migracija kao vodica..

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lucani_(ancient_people)

The name Irish wolfhound is quite a recent one but the hound itself goes back far into the mists of time. It is mentioned, as cú (variously translated as hound, Irish hound, war dog, wolf dog, etc.) in Irish laws, which predate Christianity, and in Irish literature which dates from the 5th century or, in the case of the Sagas, from the old Irish period - AD600-900. Only kings and the nobility were allowed to own the great Irish hound, the numbers permitted depending on position.

http://www.irishwolfhounds.org/history.htm

Mi na srpskom imamo rec Ku koja znaci muski vuciji pas, divlji pas, vojni pas. Ku-ce je diminutiv mali ku (kao me-ce, pti-ce, ze-ce) sto je nekako postalo zajednicka imenica za psa. Ku-ja ili ku-cka je zenski pas (kao li-ja ili me-cka). I u srpskoj mitologiji se pas i vuk izjednacavaju ali ne bilo koji pas vec pas zmaj, vojni vuciji pas, vodic srpskog plemena.

Kod srba je zmaj ustvari vuciji pas, vuk. Ovaj zmaj ognjeni vuk je bio simbol i vodic srba na njihovim seobama i ratnim pohodima.

Овај законик да се свима жто држе змајеве у ум постави и довјека поштује, јер змајеви су уз нас од давнина, од прије него што смо и слово имали, па их ваља поштовати и чувати, јер су од Бога. Као што нас без змајева не би ни било, тако нас без змајева неће ни бити. Свако лето је Господње.

Законик Расе, чија се старост (према начину писања и самоме псу) процењује на XII или XIII век. Предање је да га је писао један Цар, а једини Цар тога доба који је имао везе са династијом Немањића, и са витешким Редом Црвеног Змаја био је Цар Стефан Душан. Не знамо да ли је тај документ био један од пратећих елемената Душановог Законика или пак засебно писано штиво, но како год да било, тај запис представља први икада забележени и то тако прецизан запис о једној раси паса и можемо га назвати Првим писаним стандардом за псе на целој земаљској кугли.

Tradicionalna upotreba zmajeva (vukova) kao simbola, stega, je jako stara i vezana je za sarmate, dacane, rimljane, sabinjane, srbe. Svi izvori govore o tome da su ti zmajevi imali psece (vucije) glave, ili glave koje lice na psece (psoglavi zmajevi). a kod nas u zakoniku o rasama se upravo detaljno objasnjava da su zmajevi ustvari psi i govori se o iskonskoj tradiciji ovih ratnih pasa u srba.

Sada vidim da su u pitanju Vuciji Psi, Vukovi boga Daboga, Hromog dabe.

Dacani su ispred sebe na ratnim pohodima nosili steg vucijeg zmaja (Draco).

220px-Dacians_bearing_the_draco_on_Trajan's_Column.png

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dacian_Draco

Sarmati su doneli ovaj steg u rimsku vojsku koja je pocela da ga koristi u kasnom rimskom periodu. Ovaj steg je kasnije prenesen u vizantiju kao i u franacaku i englesku verovatno od strane srbskih i sarmatskih rimskih vojnika.

http://www.fectio.org.uk/articles/draco.htm

I sad pitanje odakle potice ovaj steg. Mozda iz vince.

http://www.academia.edu/1113030/Arr..._a_study_of_social_structure_and_organisation

FORMICA · 13.04.2013. u 17:53

Drako je standard rimske konjice. Koristi se od kad se rimskoj vojsci priključuje dačaka konjica. sarmati u Rimskoj vojsci su takože koristili drako. Drako je prikazivan kao reptilska glava urađena od bakarnog ili psrebrenog lima razjapljenih čeljusti na koju se nastavljalo tijelo sačinjeno u obliku čarape tako da se naduvavalo od vazduđne struje i neobično podjećalo na stvarno stvorenje, naročito jer je u glavi drakoa postojala i neka naprava koja je proizvodila pištanje i šištanje, prolaskom vazduha. Kasnije, propašću Rima ovaj standard preuzimaju varvarske vojske sa donekle promijenjenom simbolikom, a u heraqldici se javlja đarža drako ili zmaj. Postoje beznogi, dvonogi, četvoronogi, krilati i beskrilni, jednoglavi i vešeglavi zmajevi i kasnije zmajevi kontinenata, država i nacija. Sve njih, iako se radi o nestavrnim stvorenjima, izučava nauka drakologija.

E da kod Dačana je umjesto reptiske glave bila glava psa, valjda jer su imali posebno obučene ratne pse, koji se jesu nazivali zmajevima, što je ostalo zapamćeno do danas.

dublin · 13.04.2013. u 18:27

Drako je standard rimske konjice. Koristi se od kad se rimskoj vojsci priključuje dačaka konjica. sarmati u Rimskoj vojsci su takože koristili drako.

izgleda da je drako originalno bio vuk (zmaj ognjeni vuk) a ne zmaj (azdaja). i izgleda da je mnogo stariji od sarmata i da je dosao sa balkana gde se u italiju javlja kod sabina pre osnivanja rima. u vreme kad se pojavila heraldika vec je postao zmaj u smislu azdaje...

dublin · 17.04.2013. u 23:51

According to the legend, Romulus established a place of refuge for exiles and outlaws on the Capitol (F.Altheim, Roman Religion, pp. 260, 261). Servius informs us that this asylum was under the protection of the god Lucoris who was identified with Apolo (Apulu) Lykoreus of Delphi, himself a wolf-god.
Every year on February 15 ancient priests killed a dog and two goats and smeared the foreheads of two boys from noble families with the sacrificial blood as part of the Lupercalia celebration. The ceremony survived until A.D. 494, when Pope Gelasius put an end to the tradition.

Po legendi, Romulus je osnovao rim kao azil, mesto okupljanja vucijeg naroda. Ovaj azil je bio pod zastitom boga Lucorisa (vucijeg boga) koji je bio identifikovan sa Apolom Lykoreusom iz Delfa koji je takodje bio vuciji bog. Apolo iz delfa je dobio epitet Lykoreus po imenu grada Lykoreia, koji se nalazi na planini parnasos na vrhu koji se zove Liakoura. Za grad Lykoreos se kaze da znaci vuciji grad, i da je dobio ime po vukovima koji su svojim zavijanjem vodili ljude do vrha planine za vreme potopa. Ovde opet imamo vukove kao vodice ljudi. Vodja ovih ljudi, njinov otac, je poznat kao Deukalion, cije je drugo ime bilo Pyrrhos (crvenokosi). Njegova zena, koja je u isto vreme bila i njegova sestra, se zvala Pyrrha (Crvenokosa). Deukalion je jedini preziveo potop koji je zeus pustio na svet kao kaznu sto je pelaski kralj Lycaon zrtvovao svog sina u cast Zevsa. Lycaon (Vuk) je pretvoren u vuka a potop je pobio ostatak arkadijaca. Deukalion je napravio barku koja se kada se voda povukla nasukala na Parnasosu gde je Deukalion osnovao grad Lykoreiu...U starim predanjima potop se uvek vezuje za zmaja, zmiju. Inace na irskom dùchas znaci zavicaj, nasledje...Duchasach je nasledni vladar, vodja, zajednice. Duchais znaci neko ko je odavde, lokalnog porekla, jedan od nas. Na staro irskom dùc , dùcan znaci tumulus, gomila, gromila. Tumulus se na irskom takodje kaze dumha. Na tumulusima su se nekad okupljali sabori i tu se dumalo, savetovalo, a saborima je predsedavao dukas, nasledni vodja. Takodje na irskom linn znaci potomstvo, a lìon znaci puniti pun. Odavde verovatno Deukalion znaci vodja, rodonacelnik, naseg naroda. Odavde potice i titula Duke - Dux - Nasledni vodja. Odavde potice i ime Duklja sto znaci postojbina, zavicaj.

In Greek mythology, Deucalion was a son of Prometheus; ancient sources name his mother as Clymene, Hesione, or Pronoia.[1] The anger of Zeus was ignited by the hubris of the Pelasgians, and he decided to put an end to the Bronze Age. Lycaon, the king of Arcadia, had sacrificed a boy to Zeus, who was appalled by this savage offering. Zeus loosed a deluge, so that the rivers ran in torrents and the sea flooded the coastal plain, engulfed the foothills with spray, and washed everything clean. Deucalion, with the aid of his father Prometheus, was saved from this deluge by building a chest (literally “chest” like the Bible's “ark,” which means “box”).

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Deucalion

Jos jedna legenda kaze da je Apolo (vuciji bog) u obliku vuka zaveo jednu od vodenih nimfi (Korikiju) koja je sa sestrama zivela na parnasosu u Korikijskoj pecini i da mu je ona rodila sina Lykorosa koji je onda osnovao grad i nazvao ga po sebi Lykoreia. Interesantno je da se za Apola kaze da je kao bog stocarstva ubijao vukove. Danas se smatra da su Pyrrhos, Deukalion i Lykoros jedna te ista osoba. Lykoros znaci onaj koji brani od vukova. Ali on je takodje poznat i kao Lykos sto znaci vuk spasilac. Ova dva imena zajedno daju vucijeg pastira. U delfima je postojala bronzana statua vuka, koja podseca na vuka koji je otkrio pljackasa hrama. Ovaj vuk je ubio pljackasa u sumi na parnasosu posto je ovaj zaspao nakon sto je zakopao ukradeno blago. vuk je onda odlazio u hram u delfima i zavijao svaki dan, dok ljudi jednog dana nisu odlucili da ga slede u sumu gde su nasli ukradeno blago. Vuk je jedan od simbola Apula (Apola) boga koji ape, ujeda. Vuk je takodje jedan od oblika koji Apolo uzima s vremena na vreme. Vuk je doneo Apolu lovorov venac kada je ovaj ubio Pythona, zmaja (zmiju) koji je na vucijoj planini cuvao omfalos, pupak sveta tako sto je bio obavijen oko njega u spiralu.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Laurel_wreath

Vuk se pojavljuje u jos jednoj legendi vezanoj za delfe. U njoj jr izvesni Lykos, koji je pokusao da ukrade apolov tronozac, kamenovan do smrti. Ono sto je bitno u ovoj prici je da je ovaj heroj nosio ime Lykos pre Herakla. Iz svega sto danas znamo moze se zakljuciti da je nekada na parnasosu postojao lokalni heroj Lykos (Lykoros)-Pyrrhos-Deukalion koji je kasnije zamenjen Apolom i postao je neprijatelj novog boga. Ovaj Pyrrhos moze da bude Neoptolemus (koji je bio poznat kao Pyrrhos, crvenokosi) a koji je bio sin Ahila i predak Aleksandra makedonskog. Ovaj neoptolemus se borio na strani grka protiv trojanaca i bio je zapamcen kao veliki borac ali i kao hladnokrvni bezosecajni ubica.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Neoptolemus

Takodje Lykoreia moze da znaci i grad na vucijoj planini, a Lykoreus moze da znaci i covek sa vucije planine. Mozda ovde moze da se nazre staro ime Parnasosa, ciji se jedan vrh i danas zove Liakura ili Lykeri. Moguce je da je ime parnasos doslo sa sledbenicima kulta apolona iz male azije. Deukalion-Lykoros ima paralelu u Arkadijskom junaku iz vremena potopa Lykaonu. Lykaon je uzeo vuciji oblik, i posle potopa je osnovao Lykosuru jos jedan vuciji grad. Lykaon je uzimajuci vuciji oblik dok je vodio prezivele od potopa jos jednom ukazao na ulogu vuka kao vodica ljudi.

http://books.google.ie/books?id=wqe...voAY&ved=0CC0Q6AEwAA#v=snippet&q=wolf&f=false

Danas se smatra da je legenda o dolasku Apula na vuciju planinu, ustvari opis Dorskih osvajanja peloponeza u kome su oni pokorili starosedeoce Lapithes (Ljude kamena) i Dryopes (Ljude hrasta). U legendi o Deukalionu se kaze da su Deukalion (Pyrrhos) i njegova zena Pyrrha ponovo naselili zemlju tako sto su bacili kamenje preko glave, nakon cega je iz svakog kamena israstao covek. Takodje postoje mitovi koji kazu da su prvi ljudi nastali iz drveca. Homer je imao izreku: "Ti ne potices ni od kamena ni od hrasta", sto znaci ti imas ljudske roditelje, grcke roditelje, ti ne pripadas starim narodima. Ono sto je interesantno je da se Deukalion (Phyrros) i Phyrra vezuju i za Tesaliju i da se kaze da su bili prvi kralj i kraljica severne grcke i da su bili vodje bronzanih ljudi, ratnicke rase koja je bila prva koja je imala ljudske roditelje.

DEUKALION and PYRRHA were the first king and queen of Northern Greece--the regions of Opountian Lokris, Malis, Phthiotis and the Thessalian lands. Deukalion was the son of Prometheus, the creator of mankind, while Pyrrha was the daughter of Pandora, the first woman.

They were born in the time of the Bronze Race of Man, a warlike race who succeeded the Silver and the Gold. Of these the Bronze was the first naturally born generation, and the first to include both men and women. The first race, the Golden, had been moulded of earth in the time of Kronos, and passed away without producing any issue. The second race, the Silver, was created by Prometheus during the reign of Zeus, and marrying the Melian nymphs sired the Bronze race.

http://www.theoi.com/Heros/Deukalion.html

Takodje danas se smatra da je originalno svetiliste u delfima je bilo u pecini koja se zove Corycian Cave (Korikijska pecina). Tu je u staro vreme bilo svetiliste boginje Gaie.Takodje tu je bilo i svetiliste boga podzemlja i vode, velike zmije Typhona, Pythona, Velesa. Takodje tu se slavio i vuciji bog Lykos (Lykoros)-Pyrrhos-Deukalion odnosno Kronos, Crom Dubh, Hromi daba, vuciji bog pastira a takodje tu se slavio i kurati bog Pan.

Interesantno je da na staro irskom Pit znaci vulva, Pitcka. Na germanskim jezicima Pit znaci rupa u zemlji ali i izvor vode. Ja mislim da sve ove reci poticu iz istog korena koji znaci rupa u majki zemlji, njena pitcka.

http://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/pit#Irish

Na staro irskom "tonn" znaci talas, sipanje, kuljanje.

Kada se spoje PitTonn dobija se kuljanje iz majcine Pitcke, menstruacija koja je bila postovana u staro vreme kao voda zivota i bila je originalna sveta vodica. Iz ovoga proizilazi da je Korikijska pecina postovana kao sveta Pitcke majke zemlje iz koje kulja sveta voda. Zato su za ovu pecinu vezane vodene nimfe. Zato se pecine i izvori postuju kao sveta mesta. Kod nas je Sveta pitcka postala sveta petka.

irska: boginja plodnosti brigita postaje sveta brigita povezana sa mnogo svetih izvora. najvazniji zenski svetac.
srbija: boginja plodnosti postaje sveta petka zastitnica žena povezana sa mnogo svetih izvora. najvazniji zenski svetac.
vedanska boginja danu boginja plodnosti i izvora reka i tekuce vode.

Zato je u delfima bio pupak sveta i zato je pupak bio okruzen zmijom pupcanom vrpcom.

Kaze se da su ovu pecinu otkrile koze (Jarci). Jarci su se u rimu zrtvovali bogu Lucorisu.

Vuciji narod Evrope

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