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    Learn Where ethnic hatreds between Serbia and Bosnia began. The Key to understanding the problems of today is found in your Bible. The Lessons of history may once again be repeated.
    The peoples of Serbia, Croatia and Bosnia are once again a thorn in the side of Europe and a powder keg which threatens to explode the NATO alliance. The attempt to build a "Greater Serbia" at the cost of Bosnian lives is not new.
    On June 28, 1914, the Serbian assassination of Austrian Archduke Franz Ferdinand and his wife in Sarajevo, Bosnia proved to be the flash point which ignited World War One. At that time the move for a "Greater Serbia" was crushed when Austria retaliated.
    Austria continued its support for Bulgaria and gained support from Germany against the Serbs. Within a month of the assassination, Austria delivered a deliberately unpalatable ultimatum to Serbia, with a twenty-four hour deadline for reply.
    Three days later Austria, with German backing, declared war on Serbia. Russia quickly allied herself with Serbia and World War One began.

    New Greater Serbia

    Today, with Eastern Europe attempting to cope with new realities, the Serbs once again are attempting to push for a "Greater Serbia" once again, built on the bodies of Bosnian Muslims. If you think the events of 1914 are hard to understand, it is no wonder that the world leaders of today can't sort things out.
    These Balkan peoples have been described as "Satan's crucible for brewing wars" by Richard Maybury, editor of Early Warning Report (May 1994).
    While it seems to be religious differences that are fueling the problem of this region, there is in fact something more to this story of the ethnic hatreds between these peoples. The Serbs and the Croats are ethnically related and are united in the hatred of the Bosnian's, who also appear to be the same but are ethnically different. Understanding the origins of these wars between these two peoples can help clear up the muddle of world events.

    Bible Beginnings

    Does the Bible reveal who the Serbs, Croats, and Bosnians are? And if its does, can the Bible give us any insight into what role these people will play in future world events and the coming of the Beast of Bible prophecy, and the second coming of Jesus Christ?
    The Answer is Yes!
    The Clues of the national identity of all peoples begin with the divisions of the populations in Genesis. It is there that we must look for the origins of all peoples and all ethnic groups. The forbearer of all peoples on earth today are the 8 people who re-established human populations when they stepped off the ark. Noah and his Family.
    Notice after the flood in Genesis 8:18, God commanded Noah and his family to "replenish" the earth (Genesis 9:1), and from these eight, all the peoples of the earth derived (Genesis 9:19).
    The 10th chapter of Genesis is noted by all scholars as the "Table of Nations." Far from being a boring table of genealogy, it is the key to understanding the ethnic groups all over the world. All of our ancestors are mentioned here. If you could accurately trace your family tree you will eventually end up back to one of these patriarchs.
    Genesis 10: tells of Noah's eldest son Japheth. His descendants were divided first by Language, then by their families or clans, and later as their families grew, into nations. These same is said by Noah's second and third sons, (Genesis 10:20, 31). Notice that the first dividing factor was language!
    Where did these divisions begin?
    At Babel of course!
    When did these divisions begin?
    In the time of Peleg
    Notice Genesis 10:25: "And unto Eber were born two sons: the name of one was Peleg; for in his days was the earth divided;" Peleg in Hebrew means "division."

    Living in Peleg's Time

    It didn't take long for mankind to return to criminal behavior which God had punished with the flood. When it comes to learning the lessons of History, the human mind has the attention span of a mayfly. God understands human nature and the criminal tendencies of man's mind (Genesis 8:21; Jer 17:9).
    While Noah' was righteous in God's sight (Gen 6:9; Heb 11:7), and God spared his whole family because of Noah's righteousness, there is no indication that the rest of his family shared his devotion to God and the obedience to his law.
    Shem had several sons. His firstborn was Elam, the second was Asshur, the third was Arphaxad (Gen 10:21).
    At the same time Ham's children were being born. Cush, Ham's firstborn, had a son named Nimrod, the first ruler who set himself up in opposition to God! The "mighty hunter" put himself "before" God, ahead of God, presuming to take God's place (Gen 10:6-10).
    Nimrod was a contemporary of Salah and Eber of Shem's line.

    Nimrod's Kingdom

    It was who built Babel as well as other principal cities of the land of Shinar. Today history identifies Shinar as the land in the delta of the Tigris and Euphrates Rivers at the head of the Persian Gulf. The Original settlements there were made by peoples archaeologists describe as Sumerians (Shemites), people of the Ubia-Culture. We are told that Babel was the "beginning of his Kingdom" Nimrod's Capital.

    Confirming the Biblical account, "In its [Ubiad] culture assemblage are found molded clay bricks of uniform shape, the beginnings of temple architecture, and artifacts of copper" (Ancient Civilizations, p.25).

    When Nimrod established his kingdom, "the whole earth was of one language, and of one speech" (Gen 11:1). Nimrod and his followers arrived in Shinar from the east crossing the Zagros Mountains of western Iran to reach the fertile Mesopotamian plain (Gen 11:2).

    Between the Tigris and Euphrates rivers, Nimrod built Babel. In the Babylonian texts, Babel is recorded as Bab-ili and means the "gate of god" (see Bullinger's Companion Bible).

    Nimrod had set himself up as a god, and he ruled from Babel, and judged the people. He wanted unity among all peoples to consolidate his power. His plan was world rulership.

    The tower that he built was the symbol of his power. He undoubtedly had flags, banners, and anthems, and a "name" for his world government in opposition to God (Gen 11:4). If his city was named "the city of god" then his kingdom was likely called the "kingdom of god," as well!

    Nimrod's purpose was consolidation of all the growing families of the post-flood mankind under his control. The last thing he wanted to have was his power divided and diluted-"scattered abroad upon the face of the whole earth" (Gen 11:4).

    Remember God commissioned Noah to "replenish" the earth, spreading mankind through the "whole earth" (Gen 9:1). Nimrod was deliberately thwarting God's plan, and the work of his servant Noah.

    Dividing Nations by Dividing Languages

    God was aware of Nimrod's plans. God said: "And YHWH said, Behold, the people is one, and they have all one language; and this they begin to do: and now nothing will be restrained from them, which they have imagined to do.
    " Go to, let us go down, and there confound their language, that they may not understand one another's speech.
    " So YHWH scattered them abroad from thence upon the face of all the earth: and they left off to build the city.
    " Therefore is the name of it called Babel; because YHWH did there confound the language of all the earth: and from thence did YHWH scatter them abroad upon the face of all the earth" (Gen 11:6-9).

    In order to delay the proliferation of mankind's effort to foster evil, God intervened in human affairs by dividing the emerging ethnic groups into different languages.

    The Origins of all fundamental language groups began at Babel. It was in the days of Pe;eg the divisions of nations began. The the new language of Peleg's father Eber (the Hebrew), Babel came to mean "confusion."

    No longer capable of a unified effort, Nimrod had to settle for more city building, so he built Erech, Accad (Akkad), and Calneh in ancient Shinar (Genesis 10:10).

    He still wanted to expand his empire beyond Sumeria, so he attacked and conquered the cities of Asshur, Shem's son, in neighboring Assyria. The corrected translation of Genesis 10:11-12 reads: "Out of that land [Sumeria] he [Nimrod] went forth [in war] to Asshur [Assyria] and [following his conquest] builded Nineveh, and the city of Rehoboth, and Calah. And Resen between Nineveh and Calah..."

    In the midst of Nimrod's empire building, the other families of the patriarchs who came through the flood began migrating out of the area. No longer unified by a common language, these families and clans grew into seperate language groups, different ethnic groups, and finally into separate nations as God intended.

    Yet all have their origins with Noah and the first settlements after the flood in Mesopotamia.

    Where did these peoples go? How can we determine which nations they grew into? Where are those nations today?

    Testimony of History

    We have been able to trace the footsteps of many of these people on their paths of migrations throughout history. Can we also trace the modern ethnic groups warring in Yugoslavia today? Can we identify the Biblical ancestors of the Serbs and Croats? And if so, what does the Bible say about them in Prophecy?

    Step by step through history, we will begin our trail backward in time. From the present deadly confusion in what was once Yugoslavia, we find that the various ethnic groups of the region have been at each others throats for centuries.

    Modern Yugoslavia was pushed together in an uncomfortable amalgam of dissimilar ethnic groups as a result of two world wars. Before that, parts were controlled by the Austro-Hungarian Empire, parts controlled by the Turkish Ottoman Empire.

    It was the Austro-Hungarian Empire which formalized the Catholic religious tradition in Croatia. Serbia adopted the eastern Orthodox religion based in Constantinople. However it was the Ottoman Empire that formalized the Islamic Traditions in Bosnia.

    These empire controlled and ruled over the native ethnic divisions of peoples who had already settled in the Balkans in much earlier times.

    As far back as Roman times, the warring ethnic groups in the Balkans created trouble. The efficient Romans conquered the area and renamed it Illyria. The lumped the dissimilar ethnic groups under the same heading just as the Roman Catholic Empires of Europe had done since. They assumed that by calling them all Illyrians they could be brought more easily under Roman Control.

    As we can see today it didn't work.

    It is a dream of a New Greater Serbia, modeled on the Roman Empire, that has caused Yugoslavia to erupt into war in our times.

    Who were the different ethnic groups with ancient hatreds the Romans called Illyrians? Where did they come from? What Characteristics distinguish them from one another?

    Search For Illyrian Origins

    Before the Romans renamed the western shores of the Adriatic Seas "Illyria," the peoples there had advance civilizations.

    The Romans always fascinated by Greek mythology, reported that at least some of the "Illyrians" claimed to have descended from Aegnor, King of Phoenicia. Aegnor's son Cadmus, and Cadmus wife Harmonia, according to Greek myth, were credited with bringing the first civilization-order-to the Balkans. Cadmus' name meantorder" (Britannica 11th ed., article "Illyria").

    In attacking Illyria, the Romans first encountered the peoples who founded the city of Venice at the northern head of the Adriatic.

    Indeed most modern historians agree that the founders of Venice were the Phoenicians. Likely they were trading colonists and later refugees from the fallen city of Tyre. Naturally these people retained their tradition that their colony had Phoenician origins. But these people were NOT the warring mountain tribes of interior of Illyria. The Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire by Gibbons attests to that fact (vol.1 p.65).

    Again the 11th ed of the Britannica confirms: "It is probable however, that most of the highland tribes...remained almost unaffected by Roman influence...The Illyrian tribes which had withstood the attraction of Roman civilization remained unconquered in the mountains..." ("Illyria").

    The Phoenicians like their ancestors from Tyre, were primarily COASTAL TRADING PEOPLE relying on ocean commerce. No the Venetian-Phoenicians are NOT the ancestors of the Serbs-Croatians or Bosnians.

    The Romans made a mistake in assuming that the first people they encountered represented the whole people of the province. They compounded their error by labeling the entire province Illyria to simplify their bureaucratic record keeping.

    As we will see later, the Romans in choosing the name "Illyria" inadvertently retained a kernel of truth.

    In 168 B.C., "the Illyrian king Genthius was defeated by Rome and taken prisoner. Rome abolished the Illyrian kingdom and divided it into three autonomous but not truly independent regions" (From Alexander to Cleopatra, by Grant p.30). The Romans recognized that different ethnic groups were involved in Illyria, but the separation of these peoples didn't stop the fighting there. Grant goes on to say "other punitive expeditions followed."

    According to Grant, some of the rough tribesmen of the interior spoke an Indo-European language (pp.28-29), and in 229 B.C. were led by a Queen the Romans called "Teuta"-a Teuton from Germano-Celtic tribes migrating into the area from the north.

    Gerhard Herm, in his book The Celts, notes that the General Germano-Celtic advance into Southern Europe began about 350 B.C. and pushed the native peoples already established there south into the mountainous districts we know as Serbia- Croatia, and Bosnia today (The Celts p.41). Herm suggests these Celtic peoples founded Belgrade, the capital of Serbia on the Danube. But, in fact, they just overtook the city which had been founded for centuries before by the peoples already living there.

    Remember, the Celtic tribes were also named by others and lumped together in Roman documents, when in fact they were a mass of different tribal groups migrating into Europe and beyond from their ancient tribal homeland of the fertile crescent and northern Persia.

    During this Teutonic incursion into Southern Europe, The Germano-Celts advanced to Delphi in Greece and plundered the temple of the oracle there in 280 B.C. But their conquest and occupation and occupation was short lived. In 279 B.C., after suffering a disastrous defeat, their leader Brennius committed suicide and the Germano-Celts were driven out of the area (Herm p.l37).

    No, the Germano-Celts are not the ancestors of the Serbs, Croats, and Bosnians.

    So far we have identify who the Serbs and Croats are not. Bu these false ideas have been perpetuated by most modern historians and have obscured the true identities of the ancient peoples.

    Modern historians have rejected the only guide which can clear up the puzzle of history-the Bible!

    Languages Provide Link

    The Greeks never considered northern Macedonia and Thrace a part of Greece until after the time of Alexander. It may be noted that Phillip of Macedon, Alexander's father claimed rulership of all the land between the Danube and the Adriatic. But, as we have seen, it is unlikely that he actually controlled the region.

    According to the 11th edition of the Britannica, the ancient Illyrian language was divided into two groups. Today we find that the Serbs and the Croats are allied and share nearly a common language. Bosnians, however speak an older unrelated language, not an indo-European language at all.

    In the article on Servia (Serbia) Britannica notes: "The Serbs...ethnically and by language [are] the same as the Croats...There can be no doubt...Servian and Croatian languages are almost identical." And in the article on "Illyria" Britannica describes the Croats and the Serbs as "two groups of tribes who spoke a single language and were so closely related that the origin of the distinction between them is obscure."

    But in commenting on the Bosnian language, the article writes: "All of the national songs [of the region] were written [by contrast] and published in that dialect [Bosnian]...into which the Bible has also been translated."

    Romans Preserve Kernel of Truth

    Remember, it was originally on the basis of languages that the ethnic groups of the world were divided at Babel. And the original name of Babel in Semitic was Bab-ili-Bab (the Gate) ili (the god).

    The Kernel of truth the Romans retained was in naming the peoples of modern Yugoslavia by the name the Greeks gave them. "The peoples of the god," the Illi, the Illyrians!

    Again verification from the Britannica: The very name seems originally to have been ethnological rather than geographic term (11th ed., "Illyria").

    In Greek the word Illinos meant "the god," and Illil referred to the god "Bel," or "Baal." These words are told under the article on Sumer, are of Sumerian origin! Sumerian was read out loud, probably as a ritual language until a very late period, because we have a number of pure Sumerian words reproduced in Greek Transliteration." Sumerian was not an Indo-European language!

    Sumerian, we are told by A.H. Sayce in his article "Sumer" in the 11th ed., Britannica, was an agglutinative language, meaning it was glued together from separate lements, and early language indeed. It has he admits, a tempting resemblance to Turkish." He further states it is a prehistoric philological remnant, similar to Finnish, Estonian, or Basque, identified by some scholars as Ural-Altaic, not Indo-European at all.

    Confirming Sayce, Chester G. Starr notes: "The Sumerians...are a linguistic puzzle, for their agglutinative, monosyllabic speech [is not found in] a major group of languages" (A History of the Ancient World, p.35).

    The Illyrians remained a divided people in Roman times. And the name applied to them came from the name Babel before the confusion of languages!

    New Archaeological Evidence

    Again, we are taken back to the time of Nimrod and his failed attempt to dominate all the ethnic groups from his capital at Babel.

    The area Nimrod first dominated is known today as the "cradle of civilization"" because the first military forts were built there to protect the agrarian economy.

    Recent archaeological discoveries reported in the journal Science, August 20, 1993, note in this area "there was commerce with larger cities to the south and the area had become part of the Akkadian empire, one of humanities earliest experiments with nationhood" (Associated Press Reporter Paul Recer Houston Chronicle).

    "It was a grain belt..."Recer quotes Harvey Weiss, a Yale Archaeologist. "Fortresses were built and there is evidence of a culture from the south taking root and flourishing at this newly civilized region...But suddenly that all ended."

    Weiss digging in northern Mesopotamia, found evidence of a long period of drought and remnants of volcanic ash which coincided with the fall of this early empire.

    "This was a period described in the native sources as chaos" Weiss notes. The Chaos referred to is the confusion at Babel!

    Wars Following Babel

    Notice what happened immediately after God divided the peoples by separating their languages.

    As the peoples dispersed from Nimrod's once powerful capital, a power vacuum was created. Nimrod retained control of the plain of Shinar. Among the first people dispossessed in this region were the original citizens of Babel-the Bab-Ili, the original Illyrians. They began a migration which eventually led to what we know as Bosnia today!

    To extend his power, Nimrod attacked and conquered the neighboring cities of Assyria. Assyria was north of Shinar and the capital of Nimrod's empire shifted from the empty city of Babel to the city of Nineveh.

    The plain of Shinar was vacated by migrating Illyrian/Bosnian peoples who left the region and Nimrod's now shattered dream of Babel. The site was renamed by Semitic peoples, the descendants of Eber the Hebrew "confusion."

    Then, the Semitic peoples of Elam, Shem's firstborn son, moved into the Region of Shinar.

    While Nimrod was off fighting his war of conquest, another king mentioned in the Bible filled the political vacuum created by the dispersal of peoples from Sumeria.

    Enter Chedorlaomer

    Genesis 14 records a new power in the Mesopotamian plain. His name is Chedorlaomer. He came in and occupied or conquered the cities Nimrod had established. Verse 5 speaks of "Chedorlaomer, and the kings that were with him,"

    Chedorlaomer was the king of the nation of Elam who had consolidated the remaining peoples of southern Mesopotamia in an attack against the Palestinian cities (verses 1-3). that had rebelled against him (verse 4).

    Chedorlaomer may had been Elam, himself.

    In his retinue of allies Chedorlaomer had "Tidal king of nations [Hebrew goiim, a mixed people], and Amraphel king of Shinar [the remnant of Sumerians], and Arioch king of Ellasar; (v.9).

    The dispersing people of Palestine at that time included Abram and his nephew Lot. God had chosen Abram, rather than Elam to represent his government.

    Abram himself was a king, and Lot had settled in the area of Sodom. Both Abram and Lot left the area of Northern Mesopotamia at God's command (Gen 12:1-4). They had separated after they both became extremely wealthy noblemen (Gen 13:2-12).

    Who are these other kings led by the Elamite Chedorlaomer?

    Bullinger's Companion Bible identifies them from studies of ancient texts. Chedorlaomer, the leader of the pack, is referred to in cuneiform tablets as Kudur-Lahgumal; Amraphel is thought to identify Khammurabi, or Ammurapi, the Hummurabi of North Shinar; Arioch, or Eri-Aku, and Elamite prince Ellasar, or "Larsa," and Tidal king of nations, is referred to as Tudghula, the leader of Barbarian tribes called Ummanmanda.

    Notice there is already a division although superficial among the peoples of Elam. Chedorlaomer ruled one part, the dominant force, and Arioch ruled a smaller, less powerful, separate, but related Elamite people.

    Elam's punitive expedition against the rebels of Sodom and Gomorrah succeeded. The Elamite allies took Lot captive and the killed the kings of the Vale of Siddim (Gen 14:10-12).

    However, they hadn't counted on Abraham.

    While the Elamite allies were returning to Mesopotamia, Abram's heard of Lot's capture and quickly mounted his own army. After a forced march by night, Abram engaged the Elamites just outside of Damascus in Northern Palestine. There Abram defeated the armies of Elam, rescued Lot, and Killed Chedorlaomer (Gen 14:14-17).

    The 11th edition of the Britannica records in the Article "Elam" that Kutur-Lahgumal/Chedorlaomer was defeated by Ammi-Zadoq. Zadok was a preistly name. God's priest who defeated Chedorlaomer was Abram!

    The outfall of that defeat returned Lot to Sodom, where a new king had already taken power (Gen 14:17). But the conquest of the Elamite allies gave Abram the control of the entire Fertile Crescent region, which he reject.

    Abram was not interested in building a world empire, "For he looked for a city which hath foundations, whose builder and maker is God" (Heb 11:10). Unlike Nimrod and Elam, Abram submitted himself to God and obeyed God's commands.

    Certainly however, .Lot remained in Sodom in a position of high responsibility (Gen 19:1).

    Important to understanding this subject is the fact that the defeated allies of Elam returned to Babylonia beaten and disorganized.

    Hummurabi Rules Elam

    It was at this point in history that Amraphel/Hummurabi took control of the Elamite empire, including the related Elamite subject kingdom of Ellaser. Remeber there was Greater Elam and Smaller Elam.

    The dynasty founded by Hummurabi lasted for years. The remnants of the original Sumerians where he ruled however left the area.

    In his book, What Happened in History, Gordon Childe notes: "By 2100 B.C the Sumerian monarchs had recovered at least so much of Sargon's Empire [formerly Nimrod's] as to be able to dominate Elam and Assyria and to be found as far west as Qtua between Homs [Hobah] and Damascus [see Gen 14:15]...but their empire too collapsed just before 2000 B.C. with it the Sumerian ruling class became extinct" (p.160).

    (Editor's note: The Chronology of modern Scholars is actively disputed and cannot be relied upon).

    That was the end of Sumerian culture in Mesopotamia. Sargon, the king of the Akkadian cities founded by Nimrod, had been defeated by Chedorlaomer the Elamite. Now Hummurabi, the Elamite took control.

    World Pre-history by Grahame Clarke records: "The Akkadian Dynasty was overturned by an incursion of Guti highlanders [barbaric nations ruled by Tidal] from the Zargos [mountains of Elam], further waves of rough folk from without, Amorites from the west and Elamites from the east, by toppling the dynasty at Ur [Shinar], opened a period of some confusion...which in ended with the first dynasty of Babylon (1990 B.C.) and the succession of Hummurabi (1800 B.C.) ...under his leadership Babylon rose supreme not only over the riverain zone of Mesopotamia, but also over the uplands of Assyria, the Zargos and Elam" (p.84).

    These are the facts confirmed by Weiss: "incursions of non-southern peoples...depicted as barbarians...a period of chaos."

    It was this period of post war political chaos that Hummurabi stepped into and took power.

    Continuing Clarke says: "The low-lying region between the lower Euphrates and the Zargos which in fact provided the setting for the kingdom of Elam, the first of its kind to emerge in the while region.

    "To begin with the Elamite kings were dominated by the Akkadians and in due course by the Third Dynasty of Ur...they were strong enough to attack and destroy Ur itself. For nearly 1000 years, Elam was to enjoy some measure of independence" (p.94).

    Elam continued in power for centuries and are identified in the region of Mesopotamia in the time of Ezra and Nehemiah (Ezra 2:7, 31; Neh 7:12, 34). Notice again that there are two groups of Elamite mentioned of equal strength.

    Place Names Mark the Trail

    Again the 1tth edition of Britannica provides us with clues lost to modern scholars who rely on later editions which emphasize the reconstruction's of modern historians who have rejected the Bible.

    In the article "Persia" reference is made to a town called "Serbaz," located on a map at latitude 26 and longitude 62. In the article "Elam," mention is made of the "Croatis river" which flows into the Persian Gulf and was referred to in the early 20th century as the Hindyan.

    In Elam, the Serbs and the Croats left their names behind them. They were closely related ethnic peoples, speaking the same language, allied in warfare together. The two branches of Elam-the stronger Serbians and the weaker Croatians-never lost their ambition for world empire.

    They are still trying to build one today-Greater Serbia, in which the Serbs and the Croats are once allies again.

    And the original Sumerians of the tower of Babel, where did they go?

    Under the article "Bosnia" in the 11th edition of Britannica, it is noted that it was named by others for people living along the Bosnia River, a tributary of Save, which is itself a tributary of the Danube. In that area, "a group of signs carved on some rocks near Visegrad have been regarded as cuneiform writing:"

    Archaeological Evidence

    In modern Iraq, at the delta of the Tigris and Euphrates Rivers live a people who built their homes on stilts to avoid the constant flooding which inundates their homes. This area was home to the Sumerians.

    Early Sumerian culture is dubbed "Ubiad" and was a formation of city states after the flood. The term is used by Grahame Clarke in his World Prehistory (pp.81-82).

    "The Sumerians, a distinct linguistic group, believe to have entered the lower valley from the hills which lie to the northeast..." reports Tom b Jones in Ancient Civilizations. Referring to the Ubiad culture.

    The tradition of building towns and homes on lakes and inlets of the sea was a long standing one with the peoples who migrated from the Persian Gulf delta of the Tigris and Euphrates Rivers.

    People who built their towns on stilts above the lakes are known in Europe as the Urnfield and Hallstatt cultures. The "Urnfield" cultures were known for their use in cremation in burial. The Hallstatt cultures supplanted them as the migrating peoples continued. The remnant of their towns are found in Austrian and "east of the Alpine, occupying much of the Middle Danube basin; and the Bosnian, extending over much of Yugoslavia south of the Save and the Danube," according the Grahme Clarke (p.189).

    Among the most significant recent archaeological discoveries in the area of ancient Sumer was the "White Temple." This had been the work of Early Sumerian settlers in the area.

    Can we find a "White Temple" in modern Yugoslavia?

    Yes! At the capital of Serbia, modern Belgrade.

    The most ancient portion of Belgrade, sits a top a cliff of white tertiary chalk, not unlike the cliffs of Dover, some three hundred feet high. Called the Kalemegdan headland, it is at the confluence of the Save and is the apex of a triangle jutting out in the Danube river. Its ancient name, Beograde, means "White Fortress" according to the article "Belgrade" in the 11th and 15th editions of the Britannica. It had been used as a fort in 300 B.C. It was called by the Turks "home of the wars of faith" in 700 A.D.

    Routes of Migration

    The route in which the ancient Sumerians took is obvious. They went northward up to the headwaters of the Tigris and Euphrates Rivers, and into Turkey, across the Black Sea, into the mouth of the Danube until the y came to the site which reminded them of home, the white chalk cliff overlooking the Danube. There the Urnfield cultures first established the city called Belgrade.

    Later, the Serbo-Croatian immigrants, Greater ands Lesser Elam, with a Hallstatt culture, pushed the original settlers into the mountains of Bosnia and took control of the fort on the Danube for themselves.

    The hatreds which begun with the tower of Babel have often reasserted themselves and have continued until our time.

    The "Greater Serbia" being enforced today is nothing more than an extension of a failed dream which Chedorlaomer inherited from Nimrod, the enemy of God's government. It is likely that Belgrade is in fact the city of Bel, or Baal, a perpetuation of Nimrod's scheme for world government.

    It is no wonder these people are frustrated. warring, intent of destroying one another. It has been this way throughout history.

    In fact the original struggle for world rulership began with these two peoples. First warring against God and his servants, then warring against themselves.

    It should not surprise us that they remain the instigators of world wars.

    Today, as in ancient times, they are surrounded by well financed and well armoured powerful countries. Germany (their ancient foes of Assyria) leading the European block, and the Eastern block currently in disarray due to the break up of the Soviet Union.

    Where will the events which are taking place between Serbio-Croatia and Bosnia end?

    Prophecy Yet To Be Fulfilled

    The modern peoples of Elam are mentioned in Bible prophecy.

    In referring to the events at the end of this age, Isaiah mentions that Elam will be allied with Kir: "And Elam [Serbs and Croats] bare the quiver with chariots of men and horsemen, and Kir uncovered the shield." The Kir-men have been identified as the peoples of Germany.

    We read in the Bible that the Assyrians occupied an Area called "Kir" and placed captive slaves there, see 2 Kings 16:9.
    "Kir is the Hebrew translation of the city name, "Der" (a word from Akkadian which also means wall). Kir was a Mesopotamian city of the lower Tigris River..." (Holman Bible Dictionary, under "Kir."). The Assyrians controlled and occupied this city for many years. Is it so strange that we find in Europe the "Ker-Men," who are identical with the "Ger-man."
    Stephen Collins writes: "...the Kermans' migrated into Europe...[and] they were called 'Germans,' a general name used by the Romans to describe many similar tribes...There is an account of Herodotus which supports the conclusion that the Kermans and the Germans were one and the same people...Clearly the term 'German' originated in the region [of Assyria], and later spread into Europe. As the reader can see, the ancient term 'Germanii' was virtually unchanged as it became 'Germany' or 'Germania' in Europe....It is this books opinion that the Germanii or Kermans were originally the ASSYRIANS...Even today the name 'Kerman' is attached to a city in Southern Iran" (Lost Ten Tribes...Found, p.341, emphasis mine).

    In Isaiah 21:2 we are told to expect Elam to besiege Media. They will be allies with the German Led Superpower called the Beast of prophecy. When the Beast Moves into the Middle East, the Great Tribulation will be triggered to set off the time called "Jacob's Trouble." The time of great suffering of the British and American peoples, see Jer 30:7; Dan 12:1

    "A grievous vision is declared unto me; the treacherous dealer dealeth treacherously, and the spoiler spoileth. Go up, O Elam: besiege, O Media; all the sighing thereof have I made to cease."

    EU Moving East


    With the Nice summit that took place the European allies are now moving Eastward into the Balkan and other European countries.

    "Mr. Schröder's stop-over on his way to Nice was rich in symbolism. Almost 30 years before, another Social Democrat German chancellor - Willy Brandt - began the process of reconciliation and detente between Germany and its eastern neighbors that was to contribute to the fall of the Berlin Wall.

    "There is no better place than Warsaw to appeal to my colleagues in Nice to show courage and think together about the historic challenge of uniting Europe and bringing into the European Union the nations of central and eastern Europe and the Baltic states," he said.

    "Later on Thursday, the EU's leaders will have a flavour of life after enlargement when heads of state and government from the 15 EU member states meet 12 colleagues from countries negotiating EU membership and the leaders of Turkey and Switzerland.

    'The meeting, known as the European Conference, will underline the commitment of both existing and future EU member states to a union that one day should stretch from the Atlantic to the borders of Syria, Iraq and Iran" (Financial Times, By Peter Norman in NicePublished: December 8 2000).





    America, Britain and NATO

    Now that we know who the people of Israel are in prophecy. Is NATO going to last? God says no!

    Jeremiah writes: "All thy lovers ["allies" Moffat Translation] have forgotten thee; they seek thee not ["care nothing for you"];" (30:14).

    This mood is already a foot to get rid of the U.S.A in Europe and NATO.

    "NATO Secretary-General George Robertson said that the EU's reliance on U.S. military power in the Kosovo campaign showed "Europe should do better...Robertson concluded: 'NATO remains the cornerstone of our security and defense policy. But Europe must be able to field a stronger and more coherent contribution to it."' (London, 9 September 1999 (RFE/RL).

    Newly elected President George Bush want America to only go out and fight for American interest abroad. The American public in general want the American soldiers to come home! NATO will end!

    Captives From Elam

    After the return of Jesus Christ to set up a world ruling government on this earth, we are told that the remnant of the captives of Israel will return from "Elam" Isaiah 11:11, in modern slave camps, themselves victims of "ethnic cleansing" reminiscent of concentration camps in Nazi Germany and in use by modern Serbo-Croats during the war of the early 90.s

    We at British-Israel are admonished to watch world events in the light of Bible prophecy, and continue watching knowledgeably and be prepared for the return of Jesus Christ to rule this world (Luke 12:35-40; 21:29-38).

    God's Judgement on Elam

    God promises that Elam will not go unaccounted for their sins. God will judge the people of Elam, especially the king and the other rulers for joining the Beast, and trying to fight Christ at his coming, Rev 19:12-14. Jeremiah writes:

    "The word of the LORD that came to Jeremiah the prophet against Elam in the beginning of the reign of Zedekiah king of Judah, saying,
    "Thus saith the LORD of hosts; Behold, I will break the bow of Elam, the chief of their might.
    "And upon Elam will I bring the four winds from the four quarters of heaven, and will scatter them toward all those winds; and there shall be no nation whither the outcasts of Elam shall not come.
    "For I will cause Elam to be dismayed before their enemies, and before them that seek their life: and I will bring evil upon them, even my fierce anger, saith the LORD; and I will send the sword after them, till I have consumed them [as a "distinct nation" JFB Critical, Experimental, Practical Commentary:]
    "And I will set my throne in Elam, and will destroy from thence the king and the princes, saith the LORD.
    "But it shall come to pass in the latter days, that I will bring again the captivity of Elam, saith the LORD" (Jer 49:34-39). Yes God will forgive Elam of their sins after they learn a harsh lesson from God. Thank God for his grace and mercy, and love.



  2. #2
    Domaćin migud (avatar)
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    Znaci, tvrdis da nisi slovenskog porekla?
    Pa ciji si ti, mali?


    P.S. Ljudi sta bi se desilo kad bismo svi poceli sa ovakvim postovima? Prvo BL, sad ovaj, ko je sledeci? Btw, cita li ovo neko?

  3. #3
    Starosedelac
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    Podrazumevano srbi nijesu slavenskog porekla

    Jok, nego su dosli sa Marsa, ili su mozda zaboravljeno JEW pleme koji niko ne zna gde je. Provokatora i smradova na ovom forumu koliko hoces...

  4. #4
    Domaćin veKsla (avatar)
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    da li neko zna kako se crnogorci samozadovoljavaju

  5. #5
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    Podrazumevano srbi nijesu slavenskog porekla

    Kazi majstore

  6. #6
    Domaćin veKsla (avatar)
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    Podrazumevano Re: srbi nijesu slavenskog porekla

    Citat Original postavio marlon
    Kazi majstore
    stave quraz u zemlju i cekaju zemljotres

  7. #7
    Starosedelac
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    Podrazumevano srbi nijesu slavenskog porekla

    Uf ogavno. A ja mislio ti ces da odvalis fazon...

  8. #8
    Starosedelac eremita (avatar)
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    Podrazumevano Re: srbi nijesu slavenskog porekla

    Citat Original postavio veKsla
    Citat Original postavio marlon
    Kazi majstore
    stave quraz u zemlju i cekaju zemljotres
    Е, веКсла а шта се догађа
    са црногорским к*рцем АКО НЕ ДОЂЕ ДО ЗЕМЉОСТРЕСА?

  9. #9
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    Can we find a "White Temple" in modern Yugoslavia?

    Yes! At the capital of Serbia, modern Belgrade.

    The most ancient portion of Belgrade, sits a top a cliff of white tertiary chalk, not unlike the cliffs of Dover, some three hundred feet high. Called the Kalemegdan headland, it is at the confluence of the Save and is the apex of a triangle jutting out in the Danube river. Its ancient name, Beograde, means "White Fortress" according to the article "Belgrade" in the 11th and 15th editions of the Britannica. It had been used as a fort in 300 B.C. It was called by the Turks "home of the wars of faith" in 700 A.D.

    Routes of Migration

    The route in which the ancient Sumerians took is obvious. They went northward up to the headwaters of the Tigris and Euphrates Rivers, and into Turkey, across the Black Sea, into the mouth of the Danube until the y came to the site which reminded them of home, the white chalk cliff overlooking the Danube. There the Urnfield cultures first established the city called Belgrade.
    -----------------------------------------------------
    daklem,ni Beograd nije srpski grad,kao sto nisu ni manastiri na Kosovu srpski,nego je to vizantijsko naslijedje.i ako dobro pogledamo te manastire vidjecemo da su svi gradjeni u vizantijskom stilu.nema srpskog stila kod gradnje manastira.

  10. #10
    Starosedelac eremita (avatar)
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    Питам се да ли је СРБОФОБИЈА ИЗЛЕЧИВА БОЛЕСТ ???

  11. #11
    Zaslužan član Marty Misterija (avatar)
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    Citat Original postavio vispak
    Can we find a "White Temple" in modern Yugoslavia?

    Yes! At the capital of Serbia, modern Belgrade.

    The most ancient portion of Belgrade, sits a top a cliff of white tertiary chalk, not unlike the cliffs of Dover, some three hundred feet high. Called the Kalemegdan headland, it is at the confluence of the Save and is the apex of a triangle jutting out in the Danube river. Its ancient name, Beograde, means "White Fortress" according to the article "Belgrade" in the 11th and 15th editions of the Britannica. It had been used as a fort in 300 B.C. It was called by the Turks "home of the wars of faith" in 700 A.D.

    Routes of Migration

    The route in which the ancient Sumerians took is obvious. They went northward up to the headwaters of the Tigris and Euphrates Rivers, and into Turkey, across the Black Sea, into the mouth of the Danube until the y came to the site which reminded them of home, the white chalk cliff overlooking the Danube. There the Urnfield cultures first established the city called Belgrade.
    -----------------------------------------------------
    daklem,ni Beograd nije srpski grad,kao sto nisu ni manastiri na Kosovu srpski,nego je to vizantijsko naslijedje.i ako dobro pogledamo te manastire vidjecemo da su svi gradjeni u vizantijskom stilu.nema srpskog stila kod gradnje manastira.
    Турчине, ти си један болестан човек коме треба под хитно лечење.

  12. #12
    Starosedelac
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    Citat Original postavio vispak

    i ako dobro pogledamo te manastire vidjecemo da su svi gradjeni u vizantijskom stilu.nema srpskog stila kod gradnje manastira.
    O boze... veksla je u pravu ako nema zemljotresa verovatno ga dobije posred cela a jaja sa strane

  13. #13
    Zainteresovan član cumulonimbus (avatar)
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    Citat Original postavio vispak
    Can we find a "White Temple" in modern Yugoslavia?

    Yes! At the capital of Serbia, modern Belgrade.

    The most ancient portion of Belgrade, sits a top a cliff of white tertiary chalk, not unlike the cliffs of Dover, some three hundred feet high. Called the Kalemegdan headland, it is at the confluence of the Save and is the apex of a triangle jutting out in the Danube river. Its ancient name, Beograde, means "White Fortress" according to the article "Belgrade" in the 11th and 15th editions of the Britannica. It had been used as a fort in 300 B.C. It was called by the Turks "home of the wars of faith" in 700 A.D.

    Routes of Migration

    The route in which the ancient Sumerians took is obvious. They went northward up to the headwaters of the Tigris and Euphrates Rivers, and into Turkey, across the Black Sea, into the mouth of the Danube until the y came to the site which reminded them of home, the white chalk cliff overlooking the Danube. There the Urnfield cultures first established the city called Belgrade.
    -----------------------------------------------------
    daklem,ni Beograd nije srpski grad,kao sto nisu ni manastiri na Kosovu srpski,nego je to vizantijsko naslijedje.i ako dobro pogledamo te manastire vidjecemo da su svi gradjeni u vizantijskom stilu.nema srpskog stila kod gradnje manastira.
    Kako ne postoji srpski stil u izgradnji manastira? Postoji moravski i resavski (koji je kombinacija prvog i vizantijskog). Pa cak i da ne postoji srpski stil, Srbi su to preuzeli od Vizantije, sto nije zabranjeno.
    Ima indicija da Srbi nisu Sloveni vec da su potomci Kelta i Ilira, dok neki mistici govore da su Srbi 13. Jevrejsko pleme; po starom kalendaru, Srbi racunaju da je ovo 7000-i neka godina od postanka sveta, dok je kalendar Jevreja 2000 godina mladji. Ali sve je to vrlo tesko dokazati.

  14. #14
    Primećen član
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    Citat Original postavio cumulonimbus
    Citat Original postavio vispak
    Can we find a "White Temple" in modern Yugoslavia?

    Yes! At the capital of Serbia, modern Belgrade.

    The most ancient portion of Belgrade, sits a top a cliff of white tertiary chalk, not unlike the cliffs of Dover, some three hundred feet high. Called the Kalemegdan headland, it is at the confluence of the Save and is the apex of a triangle jutting out in the Danube river. Its ancient name, Beograde, means "White Fortress" according to the article "Belgrade" in the 11th and 15th editions of the Britannica. It had been used as a fort in 300 B.C. It was called by the Turks "home of the wars of faith" in 700 A.D.

    Routes of Migration

    The route in which the ancient Sumerians took is obvious. They went northward up to the headwaters of the Tigris and Euphrates Rivers, and into Turkey, across the Black Sea, into the mouth of the Danube until the y came to the site which reminded them of home, the white chalk cliff overlooking the Danube. There the Urnfield cultures first established the city called Belgrade.
    -----------------------------------------------------
    daklem,ni Beograd nije srpski grad,kao sto nisu ni manastiri na Kosovu srpski,nego je to vizantijsko naslijedje.i ako dobro pogledamo te manastire vidjecemo da su svi gradjeni u vizantijskom stilu.nema srpskog stila kod gradnje manastira.
    Kako ne postoji srpski stil u izgradnji manastira? Postoji moravski i resavski (koji je kombinacija prvog i vizantijskog). Pa cak i da ne postoji srpski stil, Srbi su to preuzeli od Vizantije, sto nije zabranjeno.
    Ima indicija da Srbi nisu Sloveni vec da su potomci Kelta i Ilira, dok neki mistici govore da su Srbi 13. Jevrejsko pleme; po starom kalendaru, Srbi racunaju da je ovo 7000-i neka godina od postanka sveta, dok je kalendar Jevreja 2000 godina mladji. Ali sve je to vrlo tesko dokazati.
    to je poznato svima koji proucavaju srpsku historiju da je sve to tudje scim se Srbi dice i ponose.pocnimo samo od tzv.srpskog jezika,pisaca,knjizevnosti,kulturno/historijskog naslijedja, etc

  15. #15
    Zaslužan član Marty Misterija (avatar)
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    Citat Original postavio vispak
    Citat Original postavio cumulonimbus
    Citat Original postavio vispak
    Can we find a "White Temple" in modern Yugoslavia?

    Yes! At the capital of Serbia, modern Belgrade.

    The most ancient portion of Belgrade, sits a top a cliff of white tertiary chalk, not unlike the cliffs of Dover, some three hundred feet high. Called the Kalemegdan headland, it is at the confluence of the Save and is the apex of a triangle jutting out in the Danube river. Its ancient name, Beograde, means "White Fortress" according to the article "Belgrade" in the 11th and 15th editions of the Britannica. It had been used as a fort in 300 B.C. It was called by the Turks "home of the wars of faith" in 700 A.D.

    Routes of Migration

    The route in which the ancient Sumerians took is obvious. They went northward up to the headwaters of the Tigris and Euphrates Rivers, and into Turkey, across the Black Sea, into the mouth of the Danube until the y came to the site which reminded them of home, the white chalk cliff overlooking the Danube. There the Urnfield cultures first established the city called Belgrade.
    -----------------------------------------------------
    daklem,ni Beograd nije srpski grad,kao sto nisu ni manastiri na Kosovu srpski,nego je to vizantijsko naslijedje.i ako dobro pogledamo te manastire vidjecemo da su svi gradjeni u vizantijskom stilu.nema srpskog stila kod gradnje manastira.
    Kako ne postoji srpski stil u izgradnji manastira? Postoji moravski i resavski (koji je kombinacija prvog i vizantijskog). Pa cak i da ne postoji srpski stil, Srbi su to preuzeli od Vizantije, sto nije zabranjeno.
    Ima indicija da Srbi nisu Sloveni vec da su potomci Kelta i Ilira, dok neki mistici govore da su Srbi 13. Jevrejsko pleme; po starom kalendaru, Srbi racunaju da je ovo 7000-i neka godina od postanka sveta, dok je kalendar Jevreja 2000 godina mladji. Ali sve je to vrlo tesko dokazati.
    to je poznato svima koji proucavaju srpsku historiju da je sve to tudje scim se Srbi dice i ponose.pocnimo samo od tzv.srpskog jezika,pisaca,knjizevnosti,kulturno/historijskog naslijedja, etc
    Немој Шкорпион да те опече

  16. #16
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    drz' se teme i ne potezi skorpione

  17. #17
    Zaslužan član Marty Misterija (avatar)
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    Citat Original postavio vispak
    drz' se teme i ne potezi skorpione
    Па видим да бауљаш шумом па реко да до СребрениЦИА не налетиш или неког Шкорпиона

  18. #18
    Starosedelac eremita (avatar)
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    Citat Original postavio vispak
    drz' se teme i ne potezi skorpione
    На Теби су изгледа погрешили ови што сунете, па су
    Ти горњу главу обрезали уместо доње.

  19. #19
    Domaćin
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    Рахметли Алија Изетбеговић поводом повлачења потписа са мировног споразума у Лисабону уочи грађанског рата у БиХ :

    "Никада не бих жртвовао самосталност због мира али ћу зато увек жртвовати мир због самосталности."

  20. #20
    Primećen član _guru_ (avatar)
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    Ma daj bre Vispak ne se*ri vise. Ne znam ni gde da pocnem sa dekonstruisanjem debila koji je pisao doticni text. Sto za razliku ne uzmes i prekopiras deo iz Britanica-e ili nekog drugog izvora koji stvarno drzi vodu. Pa i moja profesorka istorije moze da napise slicnu stvar ovoj cak i bolju. Neka budala izvodima iz svih zivih textova poznatih ili nepoznatih sklapa svoju pricu. Text je pun nekih oksimorona i nasumicnih povezivanja. Cak ima i malo propagande iz 1991-2000(mislim ko su reporteri pa da na njihove citate moze da se poziva doticni autor) i izmisljotine (reka Croatia; to je od austrougara nadenuto ime, a njihovo je ime hrvati ili horvati i tome sl. sto doticni autor ocigledno nije znao). To jeste sve jedna velika slagalica koju su neki istoricari skoro doveli u red, ali je zato ovaj sklopio sve kako je hteo iako se slagalice ne slazu.
    A da ne spominjem tvoje pravo da koristis ovaj text. Kao prvo, da bi ovaj text bio blagonaklon ka tebi i Bosancima prvo bi morali da budete hriscani. Ako ti navodis ovaj text to znaci da ste vi nekadasnji bozji narod, a posto ste vi sada muslimani tj. nevernici to znaci da cete vi svi u pakao, a Srbi koji su hriscani ne mogu svi (mogu pojedini kao sto sam ja jer sam ja ateista). Onda je cak i pitanje da li bi skorpioni trebali tamo posto sa gledalista religije, pogotovu starog zaveta na koji se autor poziva oni rade dobru stvar. Istrebljuju nevernike.
    Ali ako cemo sa dekonstruisanjem evo nekih ociglednih gluposti. Pozivanje na pricu o potopu. Da se isti stvarno desio bilo bi i te kakvih znakova toga na zemlji. Dalje se iz te price navodi kako su se izradjali ovi oni i oni su ocevi i majke cele civilizacije. To je takodje glupost jer bi tako nacije degenerisala.
    Srbi zapoceli I. svetski rat. Zapoceli su ga Austrougari. Ako bas hoces tako zapoceo ga je mladi Bosanac Gavrilo Princip. Treniran je u Srbiji, ali nikako pod vodjstvom drzave. I zar stvarno mislis da bi Srbi krenuli protiv Austrougara iste godine kada se zavrsio rat sa Bugarima i dve godine posle proterivanja Turaka? I kako to da su Nemacka i Austrougarska bile spremne odmah da zarate? To je bila gotova prica. Jedino je neko trebao da zapali bure baruta. Kao sto si verovatno negde procitao taj rat je vodjen oko kolonija, ali OK.
    Beograd je nastao 7000 BC. Ima tragova po celom BG-u (Cukarica, Karaburma, Kalemgdan) prastarih plemena na tim prostorima. Nema pomena o nekoj pravoj civilizaciji na teritoriji istoga do 91.AD kada su Rimljani tu podigli grad i vojni kamp. Taj grad se zvao Singidunum. Prvi tragovi imena Beograd se pominju oko 1000. AD. Nikako 700.-te kada tvoj autor tvrdi da su ga Srbi zauzeli i preimenivali. Sloveni(moguce Srbi su ga jednom osvojili i ubrzo ga je Vizantija povratila i Srbi se u isti nisu vracali do dolaska Turaka. Malo su ga osvajali Bugari doduse. I tako tvoj autor je ocigledno ili neobrazovan ili veliki lazov.
    Srbi i Bosanci su oduvek bili na suprotnim stranam. Laz. Bili su prijateljski narodi do osvajanja Turaka. Dokaz. Nikada nisu ratovali do tada, a kralj Tvrtko je poslao jedan garnizon na Kosovsku bitku. I ona prica o bosanskom dijalektu je smesna. Ili je jezik poseban ili ne. Tvoj autor pise o bosanskom dijalektu Srpskohrvatskoga jezika koji ima slicnosti sa jezicima Baskijaca Estonaca Finaca i Madjara. Da li ti je potreban veci dokaz da on nema pojma o cemu prica.
    E mrzi me dalje da ti dekonstruisem ovog nazovi strucnjaka koji je inace mnoge strucnjake koji ostavljaju ime iza svojih textova i koji kazu da su Srbi Kelti ili naravno da su Srbi Sloveni (sto je prilicno ocigledno uzimajuci jezik u obzir) jednostavno proglasio za glupake koji nisu u pravu. Sreca da je on genije. U svakom slucaju tako sto sam pobio par tvrdnji pobijen je i ceo text i isti vise nema smisla.
    A tek prica o hramovima na Kosovu. Kako to da ti hramovi nisu Srpski kada su sagradjeni za vreme vladavine Srba na srpskoj teritoriji? Mislim smesan si. Ima zavestanja despota, kraljeva i jednog cara koja su dobro dokumentovana. A to sto je gradnja Vizantijska je sasvim normalno. Ko je drugi tada mogao da gradi crkve kao arhitekta osim Vizantijaca od kojih smo inace i primili hriscanstvo. Po tom koloseku i sve dzamije u Bosni su izgradili Turci pa ste ih vi samo prisvojili.

    A vi domaci sa tim skorpionima. Znate ako nemate sta pametno da kazete nemojte nista ni da govorite.

  21. #21
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    Rekli su 1989:

    - Svečanost na Gazimestanu je kulminacija srpskog nacionalnog bunta. Kosovo je polutar srpske planete. Na šeststotu godišnjicu Kosovskog boja moramo naglasiti: Kosovo je Srbija, i ta činjenica ne zavisi ni od albanskog nataliteta, ni od srpskog mortaliteta. Tamo je toliko srpske krvi i srpskih svetinja, da će ono biti srpsko i kad tamo ne ostane nijedan Srbin. Kosovo je odavno stiglo do Jadovna, i pravo je čudo da ime Kosova nije sva srpska zemlja. (Matija Bećković)

    - Od Kosova do danas Srbi nisu imali veće svetinje od Kosova. Oni su se toj svetinji zaveštali i, evo, šest vekova prinose joj najskuplje žrtve, žrtve u krvi. Ne znam dokle ćemo i kako ćemo, ali znam da moramo. Jer srpska država bez Kosova bila bi isto što i Srbin sa rupom u nedrima. (Gojko Đogo)

    - Gazimestan je jedna šovinistička manifestacija. Nisu se samo Srbi borili protiv Turaka, u bici su učestvovali i Albanci, i Hrvati, i Bosanci. To je događaj od značaja za sve jugoslovenske narode. Moj utisak je da u Jugoslaviji postoje snage koje gotovo priželjkuju terorističke akcije na Kosovu. Mogu samo da upozorim Srbe da uvek kada je neki mali narod, a i Srbi su mali narod, pokušavao da nametne svoju prevlast na Balkanu, to se završavalo njegovom ličnom tragedijom". (Ibrahim Rugova)

  22. #22
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    Citat Original postavio _guru_
    Ma daj bre Vispak ne se*ri vise. Ne znam ni gde da pocnem sa dekonstruisanjem debila koji je pisao doticni text. Sto za razliku ne uzmes i prekopiras deo iz Britanica-e ili nekog drugog izvora koji stvarno drzi vodu. Pa i moja profesorka istorije moze da napise slicnu stvar ovoj cak i bolju. Neka budala izvodima iz svih zivih textova poznatih ili nepoznatih sklapa svoju pricu. Text je pun nekih oksimorona i nasumicnih povezivanja. Cak ima i malo propagande iz 1991-2000(mislim ko su reporteri pa da na njihove citate moze da se poziva doticni autor) i izmisljotine (reka Croatia; to je od austrougara nadenuto ime, a njihovo je ime hrvati ili horvati i tome sl. sto doticni autor ocigledno nije znao). To jeste sve jedna velika slagalica koju su neki istoricari skoro doveli u red, ali je zato ovaj sklopio sve kako je hteo iako se slagalice ne slazu.
    A da ne spominjem tvoje pravo da koristis ovaj text. Kao prvo, da bi ovaj text bio blagonaklon ka tebi i Bosancima prvo bi morali da budete hriscani. Ako ti navodis ovaj text to znaci da ste vi nekadasnji bozji narod, a posto ste vi sada muslimani tj. nevernici to znaci da cete vi svi u pakao, a Srbi koji su hriscani ne mogu svi (mogu pojedini kao sto sam ja jer sam ja ateista). Onda je cak i pitanje da li bi skorpioni trebali tamo posto sa gledalista religije, pogotovu starog zaveta na koji se autor poziva oni rade dobru stvar. Istrebljuju nevernike.
    Ali ako cemo sa dekonstruisanjem evo nekih ociglednih gluposti. Pozivanje na pricu o potopu. Da se isti stvarno desio bilo bi i te kakvih znakova toga na zemlji. Dalje se iz te price navodi kako su se izradjali ovi oni i oni su ocevi i majke cele civilizacije. To je takodje glupost jer bi tako nacije degenerisala.
    Srbi zapoceli I. svetski rat. Zapoceli su ga Austrougari. Ako bas hoces tako zapoceo ga je mladi Bosanac Gavrilo Princip. Treniran je u Srbiji, ali nikako pod vodjstvom drzave. I zar stvarno mislis da bi Srbi krenuli protiv Austrougara iste godine kada se zavrsio rat sa Bugarima i dve godine posle proterivanja Turaka? I kako to da su Nemacka i Austrougarska bile spremne odmah da zarate? To je bila gotova prica. Jedino je neko trebao da zapali bure baruta. Kao sto si verovatno negde procitao taj rat je vodjen oko kolonija, ali OK.
    Beograd je nastao 7000 BC. Ima tragova po celom BG-u (Cukarica, Karaburma, Kalemgdan) prastarih plemena na tim prostorima. Nema pomena o nekoj pravoj civilizaciji na teritoriji istoga do 91.AD kada su Rimljani tu podigli grad i vojni kamp. Taj grad se zvao Singidunum. Prvi tragovi imena Beograd se pominju oko 1000. AD. Nikako 700.-te kada tvoj autor tvrdi da su ga Srbi zauzeli i preimenivali. Sloveni(moguce Srbi su ga jednom osvojili i ubrzo ga je Vizantija povratila i Srbi se u isti nisu vracali do dolaska Turaka. Malo su ga osvajali Bugari doduse. I tako tvoj autor je ocigledno ili neobrazovan ili veliki lazov.
    Srbi i Bosanci su oduvek bili na suprotnim stranam. Laz. Bili su prijateljski narodi do osvajanja Turaka. Dokaz. Nikada nisu ratovali do tada, a kralj Tvrtko je poslao jedan garnizon na Kosovsku bitku. I ona prica o bosanskom dijalektu je smesna. Ili je jezik poseban ili ne. Tvoj autor pise o bosanskom dijalektu Srpskohrvatskoga jezika koji ima slicnosti sa jezicima Baskijaca Estonaca Finaca i Madjara. Da li ti je potreban veci dokaz da on nema pojma o cemu prica.
    E mrzi me dalje da ti dekonstruisem ovog nazovi strucnjaka koji je inace mnoge strucnjake koji ostavljaju ime iza svojih textova i koji kazu da su Srbi Kelti ili naravno da su Srbi Sloveni (sto je prilicno ocigledno uzimajuci jezik u obzir) jednostavno proglasio za glupake koji nisu u pravu. Sreca da je on genije. U svakom slucaju tako sto sam pobio par tvrdnji pobijen je i ceo text i isti vise nema smisla.
    A tek prica o hramovima na Kosovu. Kako to da ti hramovi nisu Srpski kada su sagradjeni za vreme vladavine Srba na srpskoj teritoriji? Mislim smesan si. Ima zavestanja despota, kraljeva i jednog cara koja su dobro dokumentovana. A to sto je gradnja Vizantijska je sasvim normalno. Ko je drugi tada mogao da gradi crkve kao arhitekta osim Vizantijaca od kojih smo inace i primili hriscanstvo. Po tom koloseku i sve dzamije u Bosni su izgradili Turci pa ste ih vi samo prisvojili.

    A vi domaci sa tim skorpionima. Znate ako nemate sta pametno da kazete nemojte nista ni da govorite.
    kad je Kosovo postalo srpsko i sta je bilo na Kosovu od vjerskih objekata?ove dokumente sto navodis i nisu neki bas pouzdani izvori

  23. #23
    Zaslužan član Marty Misterija (avatar)
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    Citat Original postavio vispak
    Rekli su 1989:

    - Svečanost na Gazimestanu je kulminacija srpskog nacionalnog bunta. Kosovo je polutar srpske planete. Na šeststotu godišnjicu Kosovskog boja moramo naglasiti: Kosovo je Srbija, i ta činjenica ne zavisi ni od albanskog nataliteta, ni od srpskog mortaliteta. Tamo je toliko srpske krvi i srpskih svetinja, da će ono biti srpsko i kad tamo ne ostane nijedan Srbin. Kosovo je odavno stiglo do Jadovna, i pravo je čudo da ime Kosova nije sva srpska zemlja. (Matija Bećković)
    ТАЧНО

    Citat Original postavio vispak
    - Od Kosova do danas Srbi nisu imali veće svetinje od Kosova. Oni su se toj svetinji zaveštali i, evo, šest vekova prinose joj najskuplje žrtve, žrtve u krvi. Ne znam dokle ćemo i kako ćemo, ali znam da moramo. Jer srpska država bez Kosova bila bi isto što i Srbin sa rupom u nedrima. (Gojko Đogo)
    ТАЧНО

  24. #24
    Zaslužan član Sizif (avatar)
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    Vispak, jezik je odličan pokazatelj porekla naroda, jer ga je jako teško nametnuti na silu. Dakle, te prazne priče o keltskom i ilirskom poreklu slobodno zaboravi, ako si ikad čuo kako zvuči keltski a kako varijacije slovenskih jezika, valjda ti je jasno. Vera takođe nije dobar pokazatelj, jer je istorija pokazala da se veroispovest može promeniti u vrlo kratkom roku od par generacija.

    Inače, taj autor koga citiraš je budala, mrzi me i da komentarišem, a za početak pažljivo pročitaj šta je napisao Guru iznad.

  25. #25
    Zaslužan član Marty Misterija (avatar)
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    ...ЗАВЕТ, дакле, којем су Срби одани и који Србе окупља (као сила Логоса, сила духовне сабраности у заједницу духовну), окупља их у заједницу НЕБЕСКУ, заједницу ЛОГОСА, са Христом на челу... тај завет потиче од Светога Саве! Тим заветом је Србе у духовну заједницу сабране (силом Логоса), тј. у заједницу верског САОСЕЋАЊА које човеку даје ЛОГОС Духа Светога, саосећање са Логосом Христа и Логосом Оца, Логосом Тројице - тим заветом је Србе у црквену заједницу (заветну заједницу) крстио Свети Сава. Зато је тај завет СВЕТОСАВСКИ! Првобитно СВЕТОСАВСКИ, а Косовским ће тај завет бити назван касније... посебно после Велике Сеобе Срба... кад је већ спаљено тело Светога Саве (на Врачару, г. 1594. што је учинио Албанац - Шиптар Синан паша).
    10...После спаљивања моштију Светога Саве, народ - склон томе да веру усмери на нешто показиво, на мошти (и на чуда, која вери нису потребна!) - тражи ослонац у моштима светога кнеза, преносећи их из Рашке у Срем, носећи са собом МОШТИ, да верношћу МОШТИМА светога кнеза потврди завет као што је раније, вероватно, ту верност завету потврђивао верношћу МОШТИМА СВЕТОГА САВЕ... а сада тих моштију нема!
    Од тога времена завет - који је првобитно и битно СВЕТОСАВСКИ, тј. апостолски - добија назив Косовски.
    Али његова суштина остаје СВЕТОСАВСКА! ЦРКВЕНА! Чувар завета је ЦРКВА, посебно црквена јерархија Срба! а не народни песници или народ који води "Коло око Цркве"...
    Чувар завета је наиме ЛИТУРГИЈА, која и скупу око цркве даје карактер црквеног скупа, сабраности народа у Небеску заједницу која слави и празнује Бога и Цркву и своју историју!
    11...Но, од тога времена, од назива Косовски за завет црквени, светосавски, постепено се и неприметно намеће ЕПСКО (ЈУНАЧКО, војничко, хајдучко, устаничко, гусларско, "слепачко") схватање завета, па ће тек Његош вратити завет на његову светосавску висину Небеске (литургијске) заједнице народа са Христом, заједнице коју је Христу привео Свети Сава, а онда то непрекидно чине епископи и патријарси од Светога Саве до данас: чине то литургијски!
    12...Његош враћа завет (Косовски) на његову НЕБЕСКУ ВИСИНУ, светосавску, првобитну... својом песничком (свештено-поетском) трилогијом: ЛМ-ГВ-ШМ, молитвеним и заветним речима Владике Данила, Игумана Стефана и Игумана Теодосија Мркојевића, као и целом својом ЛИТУРГИЈСКОМ ПОЕМОМ ЛУЧА МИКРОКОЗМА, јер су Владика Данило и Игуман Стефан само говорници (и глас) Луче микрокозма у Горском вијенцу, а Игуман Теодосије глас Луче у
    Шћепану Малом!
    13...Битно је, дакле, да је завет Срба црквени и монашки (и свештено-поетски (литургијски), а не ЕПСКИ, народни, гусларски! Тако да је и гуслар заветни тек кад се с нивоа епског (који је јуначки, а турски колико и српски!)... кад се с нивоа епског уздигне на ниво трагедијски, литургијски, ЦРКВЕНИ...
    Јер завет је супстанција Срба као ЦРКВЕНОГ, тј. НЕБЕСКОГ НАРОДА, Небеске заједнице, док су устав и закони правне државе ( једине која је у хармонији с Црквом православних Римљана, Византинаца, Срба, Руса итд.)... док су устав и закони правне државе супстанција ДРЖАВЕ, заједнице која није ни национална, ни антинационална, него ЦИВИЛНА, домаћинска!
    14...Нацију Срба, дакле, као заједницу ЗАВЕТНУ - која је заједница САОСЕЋАЊА, историјске свести, свести (осећања) историје као континуитета од Светога Саве до данас и у будуће, до Другог доласка Христовог - ту нацију, заједницу историјско-заветну, створила је, родила и чува је ЦРКВА, или тачније: БОГ КОЈИ ЈЕ СТВОРИО И ТУ ЦРКВУ, као што у човеку ствара веру, верско саосећање, осећање припадности заједници и (морално) осећање дужности према заједници којој ОСЕЋАМО (САОСЕЋАМО) да припадамо и у њој тако налазимо свој идентитет.

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